Demon, spiritual possession and free will.

[adeonekonade]

what are peoples views on demon and spiritual possession?

do you believe it is possible?

if so is this a violation of free will?

what if the person, willingly accepted the possession, and the pact
has carried over from a past life?

if a person is incapable of helping themselves due to possession is
it ok to help them?

would you consider this an analogy to mimic the concept of demon
possession : a young driver chooses to speed way above the speed
limit and ends up crashing and is unconscious and bleeding. you, a
passer by, have the knowledge and skill to stop the bleeding. do you
apply your skills and call for help?

in life we often come across people we want to help. perhaps a
homeless person, a friend or family member. do we always wait to be
asked before we make the offer to help? is it wrong to pray for
blessings upon another person without them asking for it? is it
wrong to pick a drunk up off the pavement who is too disorientated to
ask for help? is it wrong to give without someone asking?

if someone is threatening our lives, our families, the planet.. is it
wrong to pray this person be liberated from their demons, receive the
highest good, and cease their destructive behavior?

since dark forces exist in 4th and 5th density, then wouldn't it be
obvious to assume that they would take advantage of a lesser
spiritually evolved being, dominate and control them for their own
purposes and power? do we then abandon these lost souls?

what does the very definition of service to others entail, if not to
help on a spiritual level. must the light wait to be asked before it
can enter the darkness?

[mojavecowboy]

hi:

interesting questions. i married a woman who subsequently
became "married" to an entity before i knew what this was all about.

our marriage split up at the end of 2003, and the entity left before
we actually split. my wife wants to come back to me, but i will not
have anything to do with this entity.

she may have already given up this idea, and it may require my
cooperation for her to have a relationship again with this entity.

in my case, i was vulnerable, recovering from 30 years of alcoholism.
i get the sense that this entity preyed on me and moved me from the
us to china to marry this woman.

as to homeless, i use the i ching and meditate about whether to help
someone. the chinese have methods for helping schizophrenics, and i
want to practice this.

first, i ask the i ching whether the person can be helped. then i
meditate and ask the person's higher self if it is permissible for me
to help.

at present, i'm trying to get a woman in off the streets, and this is
taking some weeks now. but the last reading promised that the end is
near and she will soon come.

still, i have qualms about taking a homeless person off the street in
china, but i may end up doing just this.

in light, jack
--- in asc2k@yahoogroups.com, "adeonekonade" <adeonekonade@h...>
wrote:
> what are peoples views on demon and spiritual possession?
>
> do you believe it is possible?
>
> if so is this a violation of free will?
>
> what if the person, willingly accepted the possession, and the pact
> has carried over from a past life?
>
> if a person is incapable of helping themselves due to possession is
> it ok to help them?
>
> would you consider this an analogy to mimic the concept of demon
> possession : a young driver chooses to speed way above the speed
> limit and ends up crashing and is unconscious and bleeding. you, a
> passer by, have the knowledge and skill to stop the bleeding. do
you
> apply your skills and call for help?
>
> in life we often come across people we want to help. perhaps a
> homeless person, a friend or family member. do we always wait to
be
> asked before we make the offer to help? is it wrong to pray for
> blessings upon another person without them asking for it? is it
> wrong to pick a drunk up off the pavement who is too disorientated
to
> ask for help? is it wrong to give without someone asking?
>
> if someone is threatening our lives, our families, the planet.. is
it
> wrong to pray this person be liberated from their demons, receive
the
> highest good, and cease their destructive behavior?
>
> since dark forces exist in 4th and 5th density, then wouldn't it be
> obvious to assume that they would take advantage of a lesser
> spiritually evolved being, dominate and control them for their own
> purposes and power? do we then abandon these lost souls?
>
> what does the very definition of service to others entail, if not
to
> help on a spiritual level. must the light wait to be asked before
it
> can enter the darkness?

[Unknown]

hi adeonekonade

this is a fun syncronicity i thought about posting something about
this a few days ago.

in my view it can only happen when somebody gives the power to the
negative enitity.
i like how robert peterson explains negative entities in his book.
it's free readable online http://www.robertpeterson.org/obebook.html
this is a copy paste from the questions and answers chapter
http://www.robertpeterson.org/chap26.html :

***
"can you encounter something evil like a demon?

i don't believe in evil. there are only two kinds of demon: the first
kind is the demon we create from of our own fears. if you don't
believe in evil, you cannot encounter these demons. if you understand
and face your fears, you can face these demons and destroy them with
an act of will. the only thing you have to fear is fear itself.

the second kind is the spirit of a dead person who is playing the role
of a demon to make him/herself appear more intimidating. but that's
different from evil. remember this: they are just a spirit like you
and me. they have no more power than you do, despite how they look or
act. if you are a gentle soul, just visualize a white light around the
spirit and send feelings of love to the poor misguided spirit. if
you're ornery, tell them to stick it where the sun doesn't shine, and
walk away. if you're playful, make yourself into a big demon and give
them their own treatment. they can't harm you, and they can't possess
your body unless you give them power over you by being afraid."
***

it's to easy to call somebody possesed and attribute their negative
actions to something outside of them, in my view it always starts with
the person themselves.


those of latwii in a channeling session said something about this
subject in 1981
http://www.llresearch.org/transcript.../1981_0308.htm :

***
"there are those who aid individuals wishing to be of a negative
nature. but the wish must precede the deed. the cases of what you may
call possession are so few that in discussing the greater number that
are largely understood to be possessions we must simply say we see [a]
darker side of the individual which has disintegrated from the whole.
in some cases the disintegration is so great that what you would call
a discarnate entity may actually be present. we ask you, my friends,
not to think of devils but of negative and positive, for each of you
has potentials for each so that you may be possessed by the thirst for
beauty, truth, honor and faith, or by the lust for power, greed or
destruction.

does this answer your question, my brother?

c: yes, so there's just a manifestation of a portion of ourselves and
not external influences?

i am latwii. in the majority of cases this is so. is there another
question at this time?"
***

i don't see anything wrong with praying for
blessings upon other persons without them asking for it.
they can always refuse it if they don't want it.
it's like the discussion there was on this list a few weeks ago about
sending love to bottled water in a supermarket and if this was against
free will.


one love
Unknown

[adeonekonade]

below are detailed only my opinions that i have learnt over the
years, from first hand experience or the experience of others..

> i don't believe in evil. there are only two kinds of demon: the
first
> kind is the demon we create from of our own fears. if you don't
> believe in evil, you cannot encounter these demons. if you
understand
> and face your fears, you can face these demons and destroy them with
> an act of will. the only thing you have to fear is fear itself.

yes i accept this, and have experienced this first hand, it was quite
a traumatic and life threatening situation. an amazing life changing
experience.

> the second kind is the spirit of a dead person who is playing the
role
> of a demon to make him/herself appear more intimidating. but that's
> different from evil. remember this: they are just a spirit like you
> and me. they have no more power than you do, despite how they look
or
> act. if you are a gentle soul, just visualize a white light around
the
> spirit and send feelings of love to the poor misguided spirit. if
> you're ornery, tell them to stick it where the sun doesn't shine,
and
> walk away. if you're playful, make yourself into a big demon and
give
> them their own treatment. they can't harm you, and they can't
possess
> your body unless you give them power over you by being afraid."
> ***


from experience and simple logic this does not fit. i agree that
some misguided spirits do behave in this manner, yet this does not
discredit the fact that there is more to spiritual life than the
human spirit. take for example nature spirits, devas, etc. this
seems to imply that only humans spiritualy evolve, and is very
limited. just as their are a myriad of 3d life forms, it is not hard
to conclude that there are a myriad of 4d life forms and
intelligences.

we talk a lot about free will, yet the negative entity regards all as
one, thus it regards you as a part of itself that requires domination
and control. of course this is just misguided reasoning, as it fails
to recognise that you, like it, are part of god/one, not you part of
it, thus making it your god.

> it's to easy to call somebody possesed and attribute their negative
> actions to something outside of them, in my view it always starts
with
> the person themselves.

this is true in one aspect, in that at some stage the person has to
open the door to the entity. this can occur in a fit of rage, fear,
a soldier on the battelfield, jealously, self doubt, depression etc.
in those times when people are at their worst they say some very
dangerous things. a wise man called jesus once said.. "it is not
what goes into a man mouth that condemns a man, it is what comes out
of it.."

i think by placing all the blame entrely on the person, is wrong. it
took me a long time to accept this. sure they must take
responsibility for setting themselves up and putting them in that
situation, yet to disregard th enegatives influence in their life, is
quite dangerous, especial to the person you may be trying to work
with or heal.

there appears to be 3 types of negatives..
1. the true independant negative.. what could be called a demon.
2. the disincarnate spirit of a 3d life form
3. a fragment of the self, or shadow of the soul, that has been
rejected, or cut out as opposed to integrated.

>
> those of latwii in a channeling session said something about this
> subject in 1981
> http://www.llresearch.org/transcript.../1981_0308.htm :
>
> ***
> "there are those who aid individuals wishing to be of a negative
> nature. but the wish must precede the deed. the cases of what you
may
> call possession are so few that in discussing the greater number
that
> are largely understood to be possessions we must simply say we see
[a]
> darker side of the individual which has disintegrated from the
whole.
> in some cases the disintegration is so great that what you would
call
> a discarnate entity may actually be present. we ask you, my friends,
> not to think of devils but of negative and positive, for each of you
> has potentials for each so that you may be possessed by the thirst
for
> beauty, truth, honor and faith, or by the lust for power, greed or
> destruction.
>
> does this answer your question, my brother?
>
> c: yes, so there's just a manifestation of a portion of ourselves
and
> not external influences?
>
> i am latwii. in the majority of cases this is so. is there another
> question at this time?"
> ***

in the majority of cases, this may be the case. but what is a
majority? 2/3 4/5 1/10 ? i would probably estimate between 4/5 to
1/10..

there is only one source of life, and that is the source. that life
can either be harnessed directly through the light. your emotional
energy, is an effect of loosing or gaining light..eg.. your fear,
hatred, etc is a an absence of the light.. these feelings occur in
you as you loose your light.. the negative entity therefore is
fooling itself, and you into believing it is gaining in power. in
reality, it is because you the victim are loosing your power. however
there is another factor.. psychic/mental energy.

this dynamic can best be seen in the real world, where someone puts
another person down to make themselves feel big. the bully tactic
etc. they dont take your power away from you, they just diminish
it. yet each of us carries an inifinte light. it can never be
truely dimished to the point of 0. thus we only get less and less
light, or brighter and brighter. this also applies to negatives.
because they are, they have a light in them..

spiritual light and psychic energy i think are two different things.
psychic or mental energy is the carrier for the emotional spiritual
energy. it is neutral so to speak, yet an energy of itself. once a
persons light is diminshed enough, there psychic energy is up for
grabs, and this is what negatives feed on and use to pull your mental
strings to induce fear, or any other negative emotion which leads to
you loosing control and releasing more and more psychic energy, which
in turn diminishes your light. they see this as power, yet it is
powerless against a strong light. you could say your psychic energy
controls the faucet that opens and closes your light source.


> i don't see anything wrong with praying for
> blessings upon other persons without them asking for it.
> they can always refuse it if they don't want it.
> it's like the discussion there was on this list a few weeks ago
about
> sending love to bottled water in a supermarket and if this was
against
> free will.

yes i think that idea is rather silly. if you see a man dying on the
sidewalk, you dont wait to be asked to help him. even if he just
tried to commit suicide. do you just leave him there to die a
confused and bitter soul, or move to assist? what does your heart
tell you is the right thing to do?

the question is do, you spread the love/light or not? a light does
not belong in a box.

i look around me, and see this world needs a lot of loving.. whether
it be the flowers or bottled water, or your fellow man. all we need
is love..

[GenoNess1@...]

in a message dated 8/24/2004 6:46:08 pm pacific daylight time,
adeonekonade@... writes:
because they are, they have a light in them..


bingo. this is what it boils down to for me. and because they are, and i am,
and you are and we all are, we all share the same source and we are all one.
in every moment that we *are* we *are* one. aaaahhhh love, kyle!


[non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[james gaster]

well said...jimbo!

adeonekonade <adeonekonade@...> since dark forces exist in 4th and 5th
density, then wouldn't it be
obvious to assume that they would take advantage of a lesser
spiritually evolved being, dominate and control them for their own
purposes and power? do we then abandon these lost souls?

what does the very definition of service to others entail, if not to
help on a spiritual level. must the light wait to be asked before it
can enter the darkness?