Where will the Wanderers go

[Kris]

I was just wondering if at harvest time will the Wanderers, who are obviously here from other densities, go back (or ahead, I should say) to where they came from or will they have to go through 4d again with the rest of us who are not Wanderers?

What if they were caught up in some karmic distortion here on 3d, would that make a difference?

I know Ra does talk about this to some degree where it is stated that 4th density beings need to spend their time with their own densities’ entities and also 5th density beings will not live on the surface of the planetary sphere until the planet reaches 5th density vibratory level.

But I’m still not really clear.

[LightEye]

Dear Friends and Kris,

Good question. It seems to me, for what it's worth, it's which "future" you/me/wanderers "believe" in. Some believe that we live in computer simulation - Check out the videos here;

http://redstarfilms.blogspot.com/search/label/Peter%20Gersten

Others ""believe" in something completely different. Are they "wrong?"

I think not.

The answer too me is that there are multiple choices. We may not have "free will" as Peter mentions though we do definitely have "freedom of choice."

So what is it we "chose?"

That, in the "end," is up to me/you/us ;-)

Be Well, Be Love.

David

[MarkM]

This reply is more directed towards Mr. Gersten than anyone else.

You elucidate a concept of free will which seems at odds with respecting the free will of others.

In fact, you say free will is an illusion, as though we have no real existence, as though fictional characters within a computer simulation.

The form of free will that you imagine, that is untrammeled in regards to making real or 'manifesting' all one may frivolously indulge in, whatever one may dream up, seems to infringe upon love.

What is free will, without respect of the free will of others?

Perhaps the perceived limitations of free will necessarily involve the allowance of the free will of others in a gracious give and take mode.

Something which takes long practice, mindful of our potential to seize the road of selfish pursuit of service to self.

We do have free will.

Our challenge is to align our will, in as unobtrusive a way as possible, and in a cooperative way, with the free will of others. This works towards serving Mankind's collective free will.

After all, the individual's ultimate goal is to become as one with all others; and when this goal is furthered, greater percieved parameters of free will will manifest.

Ra also seems to speak of our collective free will being protected from interference by outer influences, higher realms, etc. This ensures our freedom of choice, concerning in part the big choice we all make between service to others and service to self.

So, I would suggest a distinction between free will being an illusion, and being the Prime Distortion of Intelligent Infinity, that which allows for experience in the first place.

[MarkM]

An additional, balancing point:

One of the beautiful things about free will is that we all have the right to our respective opinions and world views, and I would not say that Peter Gersten's world-view is any less relevent than anyone else's -- indeed, the experienceable universe is made possible by distortion!

I resonate with much of what Peter has to say, and felt like offering a contrasting view of free will, and I don't feel it is an issue of who's right and who's wrong! All paths are equally acceptable.

I apologize if I came across as intolerant of another's view.

-Mark

[AmelieJolie]

Some very interesting thoughts, MarkM.

I have been somewhat at odds with the concept of Free Will recently, and your thoughts do help clear some of the fog for me.

If you think about it, if there is no such thing as Free Will, then there would be no need for us to be here at all. What a depressing thought!

Wouldn't it be more horrifying than anything to think that all of the suffering endured on this planet is in vain?

I know some writers believe that we are not evolving as such.
But they are just people, writing.

We have to work out the real answers for ourselves. ;)


Now, where will the Wonderers go?

I suppose.......maybe it all depends on their state of consciousness at the time?

[SuperManny]

Now, where will the Wonderers go? I suppose.......maybe it all depends on their state of consciousness at the time?
Exactly. Ra says many of them will go back to the density they came from, but some will simply keep going on from here.

On the subject of free will, Mr Gersten seems somewhat confused to me. He says "I think that we probably created this reality ourselves...and decided to come down in this particular time and play in it" Isn't that free will?:confused:

[LightEye]

Dear Friends,

http://discovermagazine.com/2007/nov/are-we-trapped-in-god.s-video-game

Be Well, Be Love.

David

Are We Trapped in God's Video Game?
Probably not. And no, he's not looking at your underwear.
by Jaron Lanier

There are certain questions about virtual reality (VR) that I’ve been asked a few times a day, every day, for over a quarter century. The e-mails still come in, from a kid in Korea or a grandmother in Australia: Will VR ever get so good that we will no longer be able to tell it’s VR? Is it possible we are already living in VR? Recently even The New York Times got into the act, interpreting an argument from philosopher Nick Bostrom to mean that “it is almost a mathematical certainty that we are living in someone else’s computer simulation.”

When these questions come up, I usually try to redirect the inquirer’s attention to the world of actual VR research, because that topic is richer than most people realize. But readers of this column know I am as friendly as can be to weird speculations, and it is interesting to think about the metaphysical side of virtual reality.

The concept of “VR so good you can’t tell” can mean different things. It might mean that a person who started off in natural reality can be fooled by a simulation, or it might mean that a being who was created as part of a simulation can become conscious.

[MarkM]

A friend of mine is a brilliant computer guy, and believes sentient virtual lifeforms will soon be a reality. I'd hate to be the one to have to tell the poor 'thing' that it had no soul. (i.e., 'Data', in Star Trek)

On the other hand, maybe the idea would be to build a suitable artificial vessel for a soul to occupy and interact with us 'reallies' through - wait a minute, this reminds me of something the 'Orion (STO) Group' is purported to have already done.

So, let's not go there.

Hmm...if we were in an artificial, virtual reality, and our bodies were virtual reality, and this virtual reality was all we knew, how would we come to suspect that there was a real reality out there, somewhere?

Perhaps only through the memory of a time before entering into the virtual reality environment, or maybe even a strange awareness or sensing of some phenomena that seems to not conform to the known parameters of your environment, somehow.

And then - this is what's really going to keep you up at night - you're going to wonder (if you've come to the stage of suspecting that you're in a virtual environment) if your senses provide you with correct information about your environment, if your memories are real, or 'memorex' - and you wonder, "Am I even my mind? Is my mind not really me?"

"Where is me?! What am I? Where does the real me leave off and the virtual me begin?"

"Am I a virtual entity?"


Wow, talk about an identity crisis!

So now the whole question's kind of turned itself inside-out, and you've got no frame of reference at all. You go through all kinds of mental and philosophical gymnastics, such as, "I think, therefore I am," and, "How many pins can stand on the head of an angel?"

So you decide eventually to re-visit your original premise, that you may indeed be living in a virtual reality, built by someone living in a separate, greater, real reality.

Hmm... separate...

Hmm...real...

"Hey," you say, "wait a minute! What about this supposed outer, real world - how do I know it's not some virtual fake, too? What about the whole question of 'real and fake', to begin with?"

So you begin to wonder if the better question is not whether it is here or there that is real, but whether there is a 'here and there' at all.

Real or Fake?

Here or there?

I could go on forever.;)

Right or wrong?

Us or them?

Hmm.

You come to the dawning realization that you may have stumbled onto your first real point of reference! Now the question has turned inside-out again, but to your surprise, it's not returned to its original form.

The question is now about the questions themselves. Maybe any answer to each of these questions is correct...or incorrect...damn, there's another one of those 'either/or' questions again!

So you take a deep breath and try again.


Maybe all these apparent differences somehow are perceptual distortions of a finer reality. Maybe there is an underlying integrity behind these concepts of differentiation. Somehow, whether or not you live in a virtual, real, or a custard-cream reality is no longer the issue.

Now you're wondering if the whole universe is not in reality some great single energy field or program. But, you think, there's a problem with that, 'cause if you were in it, this great unity would now be a duality - as there would now be it, and you - and that's what you're trying to steer away from, here!

Now, the light-bulb goes on! (and you no longer wonder whether you're the light, the bulb, or the electricity) maybe it's all in you! Maybe it is you! That way, it would all be you, and you'd still have unity! Yes, it's all about you...

Somehow, that doesn't sound right.

There are other people in the world, who look and smell just the way you do.

Yes, but you're the only one who's you!!

Hmm...


Aren't you?

[AmelieJolie]

MarkM,

I remember clearly, having similar thoughts at the age of 5!

Is this normal, I wonder?

Perhaps I studied philosophy in my previous life/lives?

Whenever I have read a little philosophy, it does seem kind of familiar, and I get the feeling that there is nothing I will be able to gain from studying it, at this present time.

[soup]

...You come to the dawning realization that you may have stumbled onto your first real point of reference!...


When I was pondering meditations upon "the void" I considered that as helping in some way to better "reference" a person. When one grows well accustomed to "the void" then maybe there's some advantage within the idea of living immersed as floating in relativisms.


soup

[Billuminous]

According to Ra, do wanderers in 5D and 6D experience both time/space and space/time or is it all integrated at that point?

[soup]

...According to Ra, do wanderers in 5D and 6D experience both time/space and space/time or is it all integrated at that point?
...

That there was a Question and Answer conversation going on it seems there was some sense of how it is with some people's experience of reality. I know down in the Los Angeles area people talk very fast so maybe Ra wouldn't fit in there as well as back east.


soup

[realization]

one thing I'm curious about is people that are intertwining a little bit of christianity and science will they be judged based on leading more towards "philosophy " rather then just trusting in him..being Jesus Christ?

[twva]

According to Ra, do wanderers in 5D and 6D experience both time/space and space/time or is it all integrated at that point?

Ra mentions that fifth- and sixth-density entities need to eat because they have bodies, and they state that sixth-density sexual reproductive activity is of the fusion nature.

So by implication, fifth and sixth densities probably do have distinct space/time and time/space components. My guess is that the unification happens in seventh density.

[soup]

The question of "judgment" implies something of some higher source or self. Possibly the act of judgment better happens in a lower source or self, difficult to say for sure. Judgment seems as if some legitimate path among many paths, which may may likewise be a legitimate choice among many choices of higher selves. It probably behooves a person to leave the question of judgment to ambiguity in the interests of freewill in trust that the higher selves may choose in the best interests of the greater good, whatever that seems to be...


soup

[mellisamouse]

I think we will go where we choose....some back to a refresher in the higher densities to be healed from some of the stresses we went through.....some who have begun healing themselves quite well, may want to stay in the same role guiding others etc, and yes I do believe we have absolute free will in these matters when the choices present themselves, weather we realize it or not. ;)

[Silvanus Sanctus Germanus]

I think that Walk-ins and Star People go back to the universe if they compete
the task they were send to do. If they fail the task, they get reborn to earth.

Hi Cicky, welcome to the forums.:) In my humble opinion, we are welcomed back anytime what so ever and just the attempt to serve wholeheatedly is enough to be welcomed back with open arms. We are loved no matter what, it is this realisation that we came here to share with others. The deep seeded response of Love that radiates through the present moment and reaches all of Infinity is the overwhelming contribution we came here to participate in.

A Wanderer may come from earth, simply awakening to higher forms of consciousness, or from the stars which you call "Star People", most came here to serve as conduits, rushing in the Love/Light from the Cosmos to the Earth planes, simply by being consciously aware in the present moment.;) In other words the Love that permeates all wants to flow through every individual on this planet, we volunteered to first rediscover ourselves learn/teaching along the way, but mostly to help turn the tap so to speak until it is on full blast. The goal is to have every single individual join together in Lovin harmony broadcasting loud and clear the Earth's Intentions (Humanity) to the Divine Cosmos............................Sylvain......... ................

[Chris Hamilton]

I would gently like to remind everyone posting here that this is the LoO thread, and topics should remain within LoO parameters or posts may be moved. Thank you, Chris

[yossarian]

A friend of mine is a brilliant computer guy, and believes sentient virtual lifeforms will soon be a reality. I'd hate to be the one to have to tell the poor 'thing' that it had no soul. (i.e., 'Data', in Star Trek)

On the other hand, maybe the idea would be to build a suitable artificial vessel for a soul to occupy and interact with us 'reallies' through - wait a minute, this reminds me of something the 'Orion (STO) Group' is purported to have already done.

I've always thought that Data did have a soul. Inanimate matter becoming conscious. I'm happy to say that Ra agrees with me:

(Session 19, 2/8/1981)

Questioner: When this transition from second to third density takes place, how does the entity, whether it be animal, tree, or mineral, become enspirited?

Ra: I am Ra. Entities do not become enspirited. They become aware of the intelligent energy within each portion, cell, or atom, as you may call it, of its beingness.

This awareness is that which is awareness of that already given. From the infinite come all densities. The self-awareness comes from within given the catalyst of certain experiences understanding, as we may call this particular energy, the upward spiraling of the cell or atom or consciousness.

You may then see that there is an inevitable pull towards the, what you may call, eventual realization of self.

[soup]

Its weird thing for me to think about: that if every person in society had a greater degree of self-realization, that the underlying structures of society may likely be forced to change. The idea relates simply to living congruent to a value system that may have some advantage over others, and the idea that the exisiting status quo value system seems inferior somehow. In thinking about this, the idea of "free-will" comes up. Fundamentally, are we free to change our core values and likewise do we have the freedom to live congruent with them?


soup

[soup]

...I was just wondering if at harvest time will the Wanderers, who are obviously here from other densities, go back (or ahead, I should say) to where they came from or will they have to go through 4d again with the rest of us who are not Wanderers? ...


This thread may fall back to the idea that some of us may not have a complete comprehension of our "total being", that possibly there's some part of us that is space/time independant, as if wherever we are in space doesn't really matter because of some static nature within another dimension, difficult to describe.

The more interesting idea may be physical proximity to other selves and the magnetic attraction/repulsion that we experience in those ways, which could likewise tie in with the idea of "the unmanifested being" as experienced by Ra upon the planet Venus.


soup

[Aghsan Branch]

I wonder...after the dimensional shift, the Wanderers now being in 4d will realize their true identity and possibly return to that higher density or will the Wanderer need to progress just the same as all... 4-5-6????

[larissa]

I just came across some information on another site that addressed this question, and it felt right to me. The source said that there will be a three way split at the shift, one to 4th dimensional negative, one to 4th dimensional positive, and the majority who are the in betweens, the indifferent, lukewarms or whatever you want to call them who will continue as if nothing had happened, they will not even know there was a shift, they will be on another dimensional earth as it is now.

The wanderers, on the other hand, who have come from elsewhere, will return to wherever they came from. That would be nice, for those of us who think we might be wanderers. I've wanted to leave forever, don't want to come back, but must have some reason to be here, that's becoming more and more clear.

Maybe the Law of One said something like that, if it did, I didn't catch it. I am going through the material slowly, as there is so much to take in. So, maybe someone can confirm if Ra said something to that effect.

[btsumm]

That is an interesting question...I don't think the answer is yes or no...but that will be up to the wanderers themselves...I'm sure once they have completed the task they were sent to do, all will be resolved.

Peace, Love, Unity,
Brian

[mellisamouse]

I used to think that I wanted to stay, because the earth is so beautiful and I would love to help restore everything, and if that is our 4D positive task, I'm in. Otherwise, latley I just wanna get out of here. I feel like we have sounded the trumpet. A few have headed the warning, and there is not too much left to do. They will at this point either get it, or not get it.

That is just what my gut says though. ;)

[FIIISH]

My intention is to do what I agreed to do in my contract, once I can fully recall what the heck it is that I agreed to do!!! :D

After that, it all depends on what the options are. I think it
unwise to decide before being fully aware of all the possible
options, outcomes, opportunities for growth and to be of service.

I get the impression as an Aquarian that I will be here for awhile helping
with the transition and leading the way for those who are less sure
of themselves...

Each individual needs to decide for themselves and has only
themselves to answer to ultimately, IMO.

[Ali Quadir]

My role is not that big I am just here for the ride. I hope to be a positive influence. But most of me is just hungry for the experience. I'm not sure what I will do after it's done, but I also don't know for sure what I will be doing tomorrow either. I don't think I'd mind lingering around here. Certainly not with the incoming changes. This world wasn't exactly bad for me. I enjoy being here...

I guess we do what we always do, we figure it out as we go along. :D

As for my gut feeling.. I think many are in fact getting it.. It's mainly the ruling minority that seem to be having some problems. I'm cautiously optimistic for a bump less ride.

[johnasmodeus]

I think it will be mostly a matter of choice.
I don't know if I wouldbe strong enough to stay here past when I absolutely have to. I'm already quite exhausted from this life. If I could rest a bit in time/space, and then come back to close out the existence, I would probably do it. But if it's all or nothing I would probably jet.

I imagine this betrays me as something of a weak wanderer, but I'm too sensitive for this place. And too much of a nice guy. I need some time with my own kind.

[Vermillion]

I have been wanting to go home for some time now, if we are drawn to this kind of message and information we obviously are wanderers.

from my understanding its like the 3 way split that was mentioned above. 4th density negative, 4th density positive, then some will stay in 3rd density.

[Alloura]

Interesting post and comments:)

I too want to finish out my contract this time around ASAP, FIISH:D

I know some of what I agreed to do thru a PLR, (I'm working on it everyday:)) and yet I also feel like I want to help with restoring the earth, and trying to be of service where ever I am, and not getting carried away with wanting to do everything:eek:...

I think it will be a matter of choice also. I think that when we leave 3D, we will have a much better understanding of our entire existence, and be able to choose a path that will be the next step on the path of STO's.

Love & Light

Alloura

[Zajats]

Well, most of us have probably several lifetimes here and unlocking it can be real thrill. The more negative forces push more will be revealed. That is the function of negative side. So the more you "suffer" the more you learn (thats why wanderers volunteered to be here). We are her to learn about ourselves. All is recorded, remember, and we have to look through all our lifetimes here and accept all the wrongs we have done. So I advise to be careful what you do and think, because thought can lead to actions....

Have a nice Obama victory day!! (Wonder what planet he has come from?)

[KassandraLoves]

I think we are all feeling that want to go home, because our Soul probably remembers that it almost time to do so.

Forgive the weird example, but i think it does the trick in explaining what im getting at:

You know when you have to go to the bathroom REEEEAAALLY bad (#1 folks, lets keep it clean here, hahaha) and you dont have access to a toilet yet because youre, say, driving or something....We have ALL been there, right? Well, anyway, the second that you realize that the bathroom is VERY CLOSE NOW, its almost as if the need to use it multiplies by a thousand? And hardest part is making those last few steps toward the loo, or getting out of your car to run into your house, and you feel like you might just not make it there in time?

Its like when you KNOW the relief is very near, it intensifies the problem and you feel even MORE urgency and difficulty "holding it in."

WELL, i think this is similar to what we are experiencing with feeling like we want to go home now and we are just done here. We KNOW the relief is coming soon, and the want for that relief mutiplies. Its funny how that works, huh, but I really get the message that that is whats going on here....

Our contracts are more than likely expiring after this lifetime and we will have succeeded in helping here. It feels good, right!? Almost like paying off your car! hahahahaa...

[tuesday]

I think we are all feeling that want to go home, because our Soul probably remembers that it almost time to do so.

Forgive the weird example, but i think it does the trick in explaining what im getting at:

You know when you have to go to the bathroom REEEEAAALLY bad (#1 folks, lets keep it clean here, hahaha) and you dont have access to a toilet yet because youre, say, driving or something....We have ALL been there, right? Well, anyway, the second that you realize that the bathroom is VERY CLOSE NOW, its almost as if the need to use it multiplies by a thousand? And hardest part is making those last few steps toward the loo, or getting out of your car to run into your house, and you feel like you might just not make it there in time?

Its like when you KNOW the relief is very near, it intensifies the problem and you feel even MORE urgency and difficulty "holding it in."

WELL, i think this is similar to what we are experiencing with feeling like we want to go home now and we are just done here. We KNOW the relief is coming soon, and the want for that relief mutiplies. Its funny how that works, huh, but I really get the message that that is whats going on here....

Our contracts are more than likely expiring after this lifetime and we will have succeeded in helping here. It feels good, right!? Almost like paying off your car! hahahahaa...

KassandraLoves, you are a joy! Your relentlessly cheerful posts never fail to remind me what 'it' is all about.
Thanks, you!
tuesday

[KassandraLoves]

Hey thanks! :D I really like you guys a lot, too!

And shoot, if i can be THIS POSITIVE while the love of my life is running around with a gun all dat in a war zone called Iraq? THAN ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE, right!? RIGHT!

I'm glad im not being a pest and that someone likes my posts, LOL...

[Raveninns]

I also LOVED your analogy and it fits my mindset of the moment perfectly.

Truly, my anticipation of something momentous is staggering. Going back to a place where pretense is unheard of, and "reality" is based on *Love*. Can't wait.

Cheers, Raven

[Ali Quadir]

Forgive the weird example,
It was clear and very funny :) I felt the urge to run to the bathroom after reading it. :)

Would you guys not feel any sadness at all when you leave this place? Earth even with all it's problems is awesome.. At least I think so. The people are wow, the places are wow, and the events are wow. I have grown very fond of this place.

I've known I am from elsewhere since I was very young, 8 or something. I just knew it. Maybe thats why I've adapted to the place more easily than those who didn't know at a very young age.. After all, I had a good excuse for being the odd one out and I was okay with that. I'm just speculating off course.

How old were you guys? And what triggered knowing for you? I never could figure it out, I thought I was fantasizing a fantasy that I could not leave behind so I accepted it as my personal oddity. Every one has their personal mythology. So I can have mine right?

(Once I start asking I might be like an 8 year old who can't stop his curiosity so beware if you answer :P )

[KassandraLoves]

I agree. I have grown very fond of this place. At the same time I know I will be happy to return home. In so many ways earth is FANTASTIC and beautiful and WOW. :D But home is where I belong. Both are good in many ways. Also, when we are in our etheric bodies, ready to return to our homes, I dont think we will be "sad" at all...We will be happy that we came here and accomplished a beautiful service-to-others goal.

I knew from a very young age as well. Probably right around the same time as you. I think we all have felt different from day 1, really...We just notice it here and there as we grow up, then we REALLy remember....at leats that story is what I hear most.

[Spiral of Light]

As a child, from the first time I was able to lie on the grass at night and look up into the stars, I knew that I would go there (home) some day.

I never spoke the words to anyone, but I had a deep sense of belonging to the heavens.

It's so nice to finally meet others of like mind and to know that, for all of us, the wandering is almost over and we are very close to reclaiming our past.

Nancy

[btsumm]

And the Nomad will call this place home...

That is my wish...to call Mother Earth my home...

To welcome our brothers and sister of light and love...

To be One once again in love...

[tuesday]

... if i can be THIS POSITIVE while the love of my life is running around with a gun all dat in a war zone called Iraq? THAN ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE, right!? RIGHT!
...

Please give my love and many thanks to your loved one, from us all. I will keep you both in with my best thoughts, and hope for a quick homecoming!

[Ali Quadir]

Well, wherever you go... There you are !!!

Kassandra, that isn't easy. I hope your lover comes back soon (preferably because the war will be over) War sucks... We should globally agree that everyone who starts a war should be sent with a floppy rubber stick in his hand to go fight it himself. :mad:

Does anyone of you have any memories of home? And without getting personal or revealing what you don't want to reveal because I realize this can be sensitive:
What's it like?

[Metamorpheus]

I just came across some information on another site that addressed this question, and it felt right to me. The source said that there will be a three way split at the shift, one to 4th dimensional negative, one to 4th dimensional positive, and the majority who are the in betweens, the indifferent, lukewarms or whatever you want to call them who will continue as if nothing had happened, they will not even know there was a shift, they will be on another dimensional earth as it is now.

The wanderers, on the other hand, who have come from elsewhere, will return to wherever they came from. That would be nice, for those of us who think we might be wanderers. I've wanted to leave forever, don't want to come back, but must have some reason to be here, that's becoming more and more clear.

Maybe the Law of One said something like that, if it did, I didn't catch it. I am going through the material slowly, as there is so much to take in. So, maybe someone can confirm if Ra said something to that effect.

[Please PM the question to Larissa]

And to address the OP, yes, based on my research, once the wanderer 'dies' it can return to its rightful place in fifth or sixth density. The exception to this rule is if it becomes heavily karmically tied to this density, and thus trapped once again in these lower cycles.

[ggw_bach]

I was just wondering if at harvest time will the Wanderers, who are obviously here from other densities, go back (or ahead, I should say) to where they came from or will they have to go through 4d again with the rest of us who are not Wanderers?

What if they were caught up in some karmic distortion here on 3d, would that make a difference?



from what I understand of it, after the transition period (around 2012) the Wanderers will return to whence they came. The only proviso I could suggest is that there may be Wanderers who did not succeed in their mission here on Earth.

1) they failed to 'awaken' and remained trapped by the veil of forgetting. When they arrive back at the 5th and 6th densities, they may feel a sense of guilt or failure, and may re-volunteer for another mission. Find another 3rd density realm and re-incarnate.

2) I am not clear if 'Wanderers' go to the 4th density to assist there. My gut feeling is not. Because everyone in 4D has telepathy and knows what everyone else is thinking, the 'forgetting process' would not apply. The mentors in 4D would be spirit guides.

note: Wanderers can still fulfill their mission without being overtly conscious of it. They may do their best to help others, or play a pivotal role in tech, business, or politics. What counts is the action.

[Tenet Nosce]

Regarding free will it would appear that we do possess free will in certain respects, and not in others.

For example, it would be pretty difficult to support the notion that we do not have free will as it regards thought. Each is free to believe what they will, otherwise there would be no such thing as an illusion or a lie. If there were no free will with regard to belief, then we would have no choice but to believe the truth.

As a corollary to this, there is the subject of the new age aphorism which states that what you believe becomes your reality. Here we have a belief that people persist in despite the fact that it is clearly not true. Examples include believing the world is flat or believing that one is the Messiah. No amount of belief is going to change a fact of nature or to make an extremely improbable event occur.

Which leads one to the conclusion that there are "rules of reality" and that people experience varying degrees of free will within the limits of those rules.

Now, on one level, perhaps I am the programmer of the simulation who created the rules, and on another level I am inside playing the game. From within the game, I cannot change the rules. But from without, I have the ability to rewrite the program as I see fit.

But what if I am a programmer who is playing somebody else's game? Once I exit the game and return to the control room, I do not have the ability to change the rules of the game to whatever I want because it's not my game. The best I could do is make suggestions to the programmer which may or may not be implemented depending upon their particular view.

If I wanted to change the rules, I would have to write my own program. This is where I think Wanderers come in. I would conceive of a Wanderer as a student programmer, who has chosen to play different games in order to gain knowledge about different programming styles, both in their virtues and limitations.

As a Wanderer, one of my greatest sources of frustration comes from the sense that so many of the rules in this game that I am now living seem antiquated. Sometimes I feel like I am stuck inside an old Atari when I could be playing Wii. I know there is a better way, but I am powerless to change it. I'm not just talking about a better way to play this game, but a better program for the game itself.

Sometimes I read that I agreed to these rules before I played the game, and now must abide by them. That I can swallow. But some people theorize even further to say that I created the rules to this game. I did not.

How do I know? Because I would not have created the game this way. If it were up to me, there would be some things that are very different from how they are now.

In many ways it seems to me that, if anything, I am here to observe what not to do in the creation of a world. From what I can gather from various sources it would appear that life here on Earth is anything but normal. Things have not gone as planned, and have apparently flirted with disatrous failure on numerous occasions.

Just because things might turn out alright "in the end" does not mean that it was a good idea to begin with. I suspect that once this game reaches its finish, all of the programmers and observers will be sitting there in the control room going "WHEW! That was close! Let's never do that again!"

[mmariebored]

Sometimes I read that I agreed to these rules before I played the game, and now must abide by them. That I can swallow. But some people theorize even further to say that I created the rules to this game. I did not.

How do I know? Because I would not have created the game this way. If it were up to me, there would be some things that are very different from how they are now.


You only know that based on the personality, likes, dislikes, moral code etc., that your life formed in this "game". If you were thrown into a different body in a different time period, social status etc., you cannot honestly say what rules you'd apply because you are not all-knowing. All-knowing would know from every perspective imaginable.

Hypothetically, if this WERE a game that someone created and we all agreed to the rules, placed our wagers on how things would turn out for each of us, things could not be peachy keen for everyone because the game would be too easy, useless and boring after a while. What would be the point of it? To enjoy from many different perspectives? But wait, maybe that's exactly what everyone's doing. Trying out different shoes on different gameboards. If souls were truly timeless, we'd have all eternity to become "all-knowing" and we wouldn't want to learn too quickly and we wouldn't want to remember anything when we started the next game, only remembering in limbo. Someone else's board and rules, from many different shoes. Maybe you wrote the rules of this man-favoring game board and your best friend made you play it in a woman's shoes. Maybe you didn't follow the rules in the last game and graded poorly and the penalty for that is a more difficult next life. There's so many possibilities when speaking hypothetically.

Anyway, that's my take on "wanderers" too. Because, until you know know, it's more fun to make it interesting.

[ayadew]

MarkM,

I remember clearly, having similar thoughts at the age of 5!

Is this normal, I wonder?

Perhaps I studied philosophy in my previous life/lives?

Whenever I have read a little philosophy, it does seem kind of familiar, and I get the feeling that there is nothing I will be able to gain from studying it, at this present time.

Many of us has these similar thoughts, and when we have others spelling it out for us, we feel remembrance. We resonate.
I'm not sure if this is unique to Wanderers, but if it is... we'll likely go to a place when we retain our full memories.

I also have almost nothing to gain from reading most philosophy. It has always felt wrong. They are logical distortions created from our most of our people's inability to see, feel, or remember anything more than the 3rd density, because they don't wish to meditate.
As an effect, I think many people that are not Wanderers have an initial hard time understanding the Law of One... because it seems to be taken out of the air, similar to many things out there.

MarkM: Very good thoughts there in your first post

[mmariebored]

I wonder...after the dimensional shift, the Wanderers now being in 4d will realize their true identity and possibly return to that higher density or will the Wanderer need to progress just the same as all... 4-5-6????
It doesn't make any sense that the "realization" of one's identity would cause them to "ascend" to a higher dimension. Based on the logic behind the Law of One, as well as many other Teacher's logic, staying and helping all of mankind would be the most selfless act one can do. So, if you were at the highest level you could reach while in a human body or out, the only choice you'd be able to make would be the most selfless choice, which is to stay and help the rest of mankind develop. Otherwise, you'd be on the negative path of looking out for yourself only. While it's good and even important to look out for yourself, it's "unbalanced" to do only that, and not think of others. Because we all end up in the same place, after we've been through the refinery of human life on earth, and it doesn't make any sense to leave it, not even when our bodies die, until it's been perfected.
All of earth, "no one left behind".

[samncheese]

When you realize that here isn't really here and that there isn't a place as much as a state of being, then your mind will be free to ponder what your eyes do not see and less on what they do.

[Detlef]

I like to remind all wanderers, who feel like going home, after the rupture, or the harvest, as it is called in the Ra material, there will be confusion, great confusion.
In my understanding, the work that needs to be done then, is just as important as the work that all do now, in the lead up.

Regards Detlef

[Kris]

When you realize that here isn't really here and that there isn't a place as much as a state of being, then your mind will be free to ponder what your eyes do not see and less on what they do.

When I first posted this question in October, 2007 I was a complete newbie to this whole way of being. I was (and still am) dating a Wanderer and was, at that time, wondering where he would go when the time came.

Since that time I have come to realize exactly what you are saying here samncheese. I've grown so much in such a short amount of time, it's incredible. I'm even starting to think that maybe I'm a Wanderer myself.;)

[samncheese]

I like to remind all wanderers, who feel like going home, after the rupture, or the harvest, as it is called in the Ra material, there will be confusion, great confusion.
In my understanding, the work that needs to be done then, is just as important as the work that all do now, in the lead up.

Regards Detlef

The bulk of the wanderers as we are called are of one mind and goal, to help in this time here to ease the transition. We saw in it an opportunity to give service and to learn for ourselves. It is selfish and giving at the same time. We understand/understood that by giving ourselves to service would help to elevate you/us.

I am the one that brought them/us (Wanderers here), or I have been taught that it was I in another place that concieved the notion to bring elevated beings to earth and scatter them through humanity to enlighten and uplift the earth at this time.

I was taught through dreams and comunications that I gathered a multitude of beings together and posed this plan to the council. When I was granted licence to go ahead I pleaded my case to this group (wanderers) they saw the wisdom in it. So here we are.

Wanderes don't come here knowing who they were. Just being here and the elevated state of thier spirit is enough and nothing else is reqired of them. If they learn of who they are/were they are still people with lives and family here, and weaknesses.

I was given to understand the main objection to them coming here was the bad energy, or karma that would be put on many of the wanderers. It could pull them down. They feared falling into lower energy life forms. All wanderers were given genetic codes that are more at peace, and safeguards were put into thier lifes to keep them safe. Teams of healers are ready to repair any damage after this life.

You ask the question " Were do wanders go? " it is not a place but an energy form. It is like the trees asking were will "you" go after you die? We are all part of the cosmos, we exist, we are. To quote the bible " I am ".

Stop asking " were " that is a notion of this time and place. Ask " What will I be? " Will I be greater? or will I need to repeat this again to get it right?

Give service everywhere. Denounce war and stand up for peace. The energy of peace is a spiral. It starts at the center and as the center rotates it spirals out in every direction. Peace is fragile, and any other energy will distort it until it breaks. This is a figurative representation as it's fisical energy signature is more complex.

I am being bold in what I say but I know for a fact it is truth.

[Detlef]

Dear samncheese,

I am not sure if your reply was to my post, or a general reply.
I, for myself know exactly who I am, where I come from and where I am going.
I know in broad terms what I am here to do, what I choose to learn while I am her.
Yes, in a way you are correct, you have brought (A) group of wanderers to this planet.
I say, well done.
Remember, by far the greatest number of wanderers are angelic.
Always have been and most likely will. It is just the nature of our work.

By the way, it is an energy as well as a place. Our point of origin in the universe or verses, can be localized with little difficulty, this will make it a place, of cause the vibration is of an energy, this is correct.

Regards Detlef
Rah nam

[samncheese]

I wanted to come back to this subject and say I have it in my mind that the wanderers will be with earth for several incarnations of peoples. I have seen myself in a future here pushing the work forward. As a "Wanderer" I will be here for some time to come. This is not just a one life time deal.

[Eddie]

Would you guys not feel any sadness at all when you leave this place?


It would be very difficult for me to leave. I love this planet dearly. I spent many lifetimes as a hunter-gatherer, and I'm only truly at peace when I'm outside hunting or gathering in this loveliest of worlds:):) (well, or when meditating).

I do not know whether I will make it to 4D in this harvest, but I earnestly want to do so, so that I might spend that time on 4D earth, which will be at least as magnificent as 3D earth.

[Aghsan Branch]

It doesn't make any sense that the "realization" of one's identity would cause them to "ascend" to a higher dimension. Based on the logic behind the Law of One, as well as many other Teacher's logic, staying and helping all of mankind would be the most selfless act one can do.

Yes very true. However, my use of the word "realize" was for expediency and unspoken in my intended usage is the state of realization that occurs when a wanderer has the veil lifted and re-members who they are/were before they agreed to forget for the purpose of assisting in the harvest. With harvest ongoing, and all in time/space would it not be possible for a soul to incarnate back from whence it came? I cannot say for certain as i still consider myself a novice with regards to the LoO.

Furthermore, i believe that in this universe of free will, it is not always the outcome of the effort that matters most but the intent. We can never make a correct judgment on another's necessary karmic requirements.

But i'm still learn/teach ing this time too
Agh

[Aghsan Branch]

I guess its obvious now that i haven't done my homework and read through all the previous posts, uhhh, my dog ate it?:(

OK Kris, guess you thought of it first
AGH

[coloradogigi]

Kassandra said: "WELL, i think this is similar to what we are experiencing with feeling like we want to go home now and we are just done here."

I had some major life changes last year and I have to tell you that I just feel done here. Nothing is wrong or anything like that, but I'm tired. I don't have a clue as to what I should be doing with myself. When I walk around, it's like I'm walking in sand. The motivation to do is gone. I want to go home, too...whereever it is. I should share with you that my new house number is 111. Isn't that a trip? I've been seeing 11:11 for the past six or seven years. My street name is Regency also. I just think it's a hoot.

[samncheese]

Time is not what you think it is. Don't worry about the future wanderings. Now and the past and the future all happen at the same overlaping times. In the future we will see that time is more of a place then a When and that a place is more of a time then a spot on a map.

Close your eyes and see with your feelings not your mind. Reality is constructed and you are the builder.

[Blacksunshine]

i dont know if my fate will transcend me into 4th dimension. I'm okay either way. I do want this earth (that I love so dearly) to progress naturally and beautifully, as it so deserves to. When ever and how ever it must, and I'm here to love and support it in the way I can and know how.

I would love to experience higher dimension, as one of my wishes would be to watch the 3D walkers do the thing they do that dosn't involve watching reality TV...that just dosn't give the whole picture so I hold no interest in it what so ever.

But If I return another step in this 3D turn, i will be ever grateful that I still get to experience, beause i just happen to love it. And I love who i am...so it makes it very easy to accept either out come.

I'm partially grateful that we kind of get a choice at times of whether or not we want to wonder. and to be honest...I have no idea what I'll choose, cuz I'm here still trying to figure it all out.

Blessed be.

[joshwaycaster]

Hey guys, Here's what the LoO transcripts say

Questioner: I think that to clear up this point I will ask a few questions that are related that will possibly help me to understand this better because I am really confused about this and I think it is a very important point in understanding the creation and the Creator in general, you might say. If a Wanderer of fourth, fifth, or sixth-density dies from this third-density state in which we presently find ourselves, does he then find himself in the third-density time/space after death?

Ra: I am Ra. This will depend upon the plan which has been approved by the Council of Nine. Some Wanderers offer themselves for but one incarnation while others offer themselves for varying lengths of your time up to and including the last two cycles of 25,000 years. If the agreed-upon mission is completed the Wanderer’s mind/body/spirit complex will go to the home vibration.

[ggw_bach]

I would love to experience higher dimension, as one of my wishes would be to watch the 3D walkers do the thing they do that dosn't involve watching reality TV...that just dosn't give the whole picture so I hold no interest in it what so ever.

But If I return another step in this 3D turn, i will be ever grateful that I still get to experience, beause i just happen to love it. And I love who i am...so it makes it very easy to accept either out come.

the most exciting thing about 4D is that everyone can read everyone else's mind! no more deceit, no more hiding! everything in the open! such a society is just incomprehensible to us right now.

I'm looking forward to trying that out!

[BenOne]

4d brings ability to read thoughts, how cool, unnerving for some I imagine. When I was young I was teatering on insanity because I knew everyone could read my mind. It was a big issue for me. I still believe they can because I watch how they respond to stimuli. I realize now that most people are unaware that it is even happining, even though they react to it. How might this ascension affect our vision? 4d sounds nice. Isn't time/space the fourth dimension of measure?

Why do wanderer's wander? If they stop wandering and figure out what to do, what should we call them then?

[KassandraLoves]

4d brings ability to read thoughts, how cool, unnerving for some I imagine. When I was young I was teatering on insanity because I knew everyone could read my mind. It was a big issue for me. I still believe they can because I watch how they respond to stimuli. I realize now that most people are unaware that it is even happining, even though they react to it. How might this ascension affect our vision? 4d sounds nice. Isn't time/space the fourth dimension of measure?

Why do wanderer's wander? If they stop wandering and figure out what to do, what should we call them then?

Wanderers are only called that because we wander out of our "home areas" to come here. We wander BACK to a dimension that we once were. I dont think we are called wanderers because we are "lost."

We stop wandering when we head back home, to our home dimension, I would say....

Now heres another question: if I am from the 5th dimension, then when do I go back to the 5th??? DURING the ascension? After it? When I "naturally" die? I mean, it would seem to me that if i were said 5D soul, I wouldnt NEED to be harvested, because I already have the capablities of the next 2 dimensions....So....Do I stay and help even after the ascension? to shine my light on the few who get "stuck" (if any do)?

I dunno....Ive just gotten the message for a long time now that I am here to HELP and not to be harvested as a soul who has'nt been capable of 4D until now. Like....I feel like I am not "going" when everyone else "goes." Like Im here to do a job and help and even stay behind if i have to.....then when my time is up, my job is done and I can go back to whatever density it is that I come from...

Does anyone feel that way?

[Spiral of Light]

.....then when my time is up, my job is done and I can go back to whatever density it is that I come from...

Does anyone feel that way?

Yes... I feel that way, too.

I know that I'm here to help in whatever ways that I can. But, it has been my concern for some time that I don't accrue any 3D karmic attachments that will hinder me from being able to depart for my own return to wherever it is that I come from..whenever that time comes.

[Berni]

Same here. All my life I have felt as though this wasn't my home, that I was just a visitor here. And I believe that when my time on Mother Earth is done, I will return to wherever I came from.

I also believe that my first husband was a wanderer. In fact, we talked about it. We had read a book that told about people who were "seeded" here from other planets. (I don't remember the name of the book or the author. This was back in the early '80s.) It described certain physical traits and things that would happen at specific points in one's life as a way of identifying whether you were a child of the stars. We both identified with a large number of the things listed.

However, I think we were both from the same place or density, and I think there may have been some leftover karma between us from a previous lifetime that had to be resolved. We divorced in '95 and we both remarried, and he passed on about 5 years ago. He visited me in dreams for a few months after that, and that was when I realized that I had to resolve the leftover karma. I think he finally did, either before he passed or through the dreams I had. And I have now, as well.

About 3 years ago I sudenly began to feel like my mission here was over. I have had people come into my life just long enough for me to give my kind of help, then we both move on. All of a sudden, there weren't any new acquaintances entering the picture. After meditating on this, I realized it was time to get myself in order. And in that process I found this website.

Now, I have gotten my energies in better order, and I can see how much work there is left to do. I get frustrated sometimes with certain individuals who seem to resist raising their consciousness tooth and nail, kicking and screaming, but I know that it's their choice, not mine. All I can do is set an example. And that's tough sometimes!

No, I am not trying to force anyone to believe what I do. I have one coworker who is a very negative energy and I sometimes get the feeling that she's trying to make it to 4d negative. It's just difficult to be around her every day. And I have tried to make suggestions that are more in a positive energy focus, but she won't hear any of it. For example, she thinks being rich will make her happy. I have said the old adage, "Money won't buy happiness" but she ignores it. And she talks bad about everyone, which is really tough to listen to. I used to try and say positive things about those she put down, but it just made her say worse things.

Trying not to incur any 3d karma at this particular time is tough. And trying to keep the positive energy flowing through me can be tough some days, as well. But I want to return to my former density, or planet, or wherever it is that I came here from, so I keep coming here for the positive energy that flows from this website.

And I think my job won't be done until after the ascention. I feel I'm here to help with that as well.

[transiten]

I suddenly realize I wrote a song "Children of the stars". "Venus" i mentioned earlier....

When I wrote those songs, i didn't have any of the information provided here that humans could be seeded from other planets, just thought I used the stars as symbols for expressing earthly/human conditions with a slight spiritual connection though....

I wonder if this can be some faint reminiscion from a higher consciousness and existence:confused:

[Deerclan]

Wanderers are only called that because we wander out of our "home areas" to come here. We wander BACK to a dimension that we once were. I dont think we are called wanderers because we are "lost."

Kassandra, you remind me of a line from Tolkein that goes (if I remember it correctly), "Not all who wander are lost."


I dunno....Ive just gotten the message for a long time now that I am here to HELP and not to be harvested as a soul who has'nt been capable of 4D until now. Like....I feel like I am not "going" when everyone else "goes." Like Im here to do a job and help and even stay behind if i have to.....then when my time is up, my job is done and I can go back to whatever density it is that I come from... Does anyone feel that way?

Yes, I also feel that way. For some reason I cannot seem to get as excited about the "shift" as many other people seem to be. In response to your question, my guess would be that a big shift from 3D to 4D may not be all that big of a deal to you. Do you ever feel that way? I feel that in most respects, it will be business as usual. I doubt that viewpoint will be popular. :)

[sheluvsheiner]

Greetings....

What happens to 6th Density Wanderers in 2012? Will they continue in their earth incarnations (bodies) and move to 4th density to serve there by helping people progress? Do they go back to a 3rd density place to serve there again? Do they go back to their 6th density existence and leave their 'loved ones' behind? :eek: More and more I am convinced I'm a "wanderer" and I'd like to learn what types of 'destinies' are ahead of me ....or are they choices? Thanks in advance for your help!
~ Kristy

[Deerclan]

Much as I would like to get off the wheel, I can't see myself abandoning the project after all the time & energy I've put into it.

Heck, now I'll have to rescue the planet from myself, in my own past incarnations. Talk about a bummer of a job -- you better believe I'll be asking the powers that be for help from all you good people who are "interested." :)

- Deerclan

[conundrum]

You guys are great thanks for the experience you constantly blow my mind... at least I think its my mind :confused:

[ETguy]

The impression I get is that the only way a Wanderer can return home to its home density is by going through the standard harvest process. In other words, there is no shortcut home for the Wanderer. If you've been polarized negatively from your incarnations on third density Earth, then you might not make it home immediately - you'll have to continue third density incarnations on another planet in order to re-polarize yourself towards the positive, and then hopefully make it home at the end of one of the major cycles.

Another thing I'm pretty sure of is that Wanderers work in groups. What I mean by that is: Even though it feels like it, you're not alone. I imagine that Wanderers operate in a closely knitted group of around 10 entities. (I get this particular approx. number from a faint memory I have, where I was standing in a circle with some other entities. We were about 10 entities in that circle.)
You are very likely to get close to these other group members in your ordinary life, even though you could be completely unaware of the fact that you are Wanderers or anything of the sort. A real telltale sign is if you experience an unexplained closeness to someone who you are completely incompatible with as a personality.

A last thing I imagine is that no one is left behind. If one of the Wanderers in the group is polarized negatively and subsequently unable to return to its home density, I'm sure that the other nine will choose to remain in third density in order to help the "injured" group member recover and return home. One for all, all for one.

[transiten]

Hello ETguy

I want to connect this post to the discussion in the "competition-thread". How do you discern the closeness one can suddenly feel from a man that is emotionally disturbed and matches with your own emotional scars leading to a destructive relationship, from what you are saying here?

That is: if you feeel a suddden closeness to someone you cannot reach emotionally, how do you know if it's a fellow wanderer that you must follow into anwe round of 3:rd density not ascending into the 4:th density that David talks about in connection with 2012:confused:

.....or if it's just the ordinairy 3D codependencydestructiveness David also talks about.

transiten

[Berry Chastain]

In the process of reading Carla Reuckert's book The Wander's Handbook I ran across a passage which is a channeled message from one of the sources that she channels called Latwii. It deals very specifically with how Wanderers will move from 3D to Home or otherwise. Here is the quote:

Generally speaking, those entities known as wanderers enter the density
no better equipped, for the most part, than those who (are) originally of
that density, in that the wanderer, in experiencing the forgetting, is not
allowed to draw upon the full resource of experiences. They are, in
essence, playing the odds, so to speak, that their natural tendency
toward positive polarization will exert itself, and they will be successful
in both contributing to the welfare of those about them and the
attainment of sufficient polarization, upon their physical death, to be
presented the option of returning to their original density or progressing
to another act of service."

I hope this answers the question presented with sufficient clarity.

[Makaveli512]

Okay, well there is one thing I don't really understand: By classifying yourself as a wanderer, indigo, or w.e you want to call yourself, aren't you embracing individualism and segregating yourself from the oneness of essence? What's the point

[sheluvsheiner]

Berry, thank you for posting that quote from Carla's book. I am reading that book right now. I was rather shocked last night in my reading, because I had just finished reading David's post about the 'ascension' or shift into 4th dimension being pretty quick, and not 'gradual'. He wanted to make it very clear in his blog that this event would happen quite quickly.

The thing that shocked me was in Carla's book, she said the following:

"Confederation sources frequently have said that we are already enjoying the
first light of fourth density. This and many other communications of the
same tenor lead me to feel that this shift into fourth density is not to take
the form of a rapture, ascension or some apocryphal catastrophe, but is
rather a process that has already begun and will continue for many years
and even centuries to come."

I'm confused - I mean, this woman was the channel for Ra and is intimately aquainted with the Law of One material. So why would she say that moving into the 4th dimension is a process that could take centuries, but David says it will take place quickly, and he uses a LOT of quotes from the Law of One materials to prove his point?

Hope somebody can help me understand or shed some light on this.

~ Kristy

[ETguy]

Berry, thank you for posting that quote from Carla's book. I am reading that book right now. I was rather shocked last night in my reading, because I had just finished reading David's post about the 'ascension' or shift into 4th dimension being pretty quick, and not 'gradual'. He wanted to make it very clear in his blog that this event would happen quite quickly.

The thing that shocked me was in Carla's book, she said the following:

"Confederation sources frequently have said that we are already enjoying the
first light of fourth density. This and many other communications of the
same tenor lead me to feel that this shift into fourth density is not to take
the form of a rapture, ascension or some apocryphal catastrophe, but is
rather a process that has already begun and will continue for many years
and even centuries to come."

I'm confused - I mean, this woman was the channel for Ra and is intimately aquainted with the Law of One material. So why would she say that moving into the 4th dimension is a process that could take centuries, but David says it will take place quickly, and he uses a LOT of quotes from the Law of One materials to prove his point?

Hope somebody can help me understand or shed some light on this.

~ Kristy

Notice how she uses the words "led me to feel"...I'll rather go by what Ra says than what Carla feels.
DW has stated that he believes that Carla is wrong regarding the gradualist way of thinking. If you go by the Law of One material, it seems to be pretty clear that this Harvest is a sudden event. Ra pinpointed the year 2011 as the time of Harvest. How Carla can choose to ignore this I'm not sure of, because it's a pretty significant thing to ignore.

The other entities that Carla participate in channeling, such as Hatonn, Q'uo, Latwii and so forth seem to disguise their sentences as to make them completely open for interpretation. Here's an example:


Q'uo: It is very likely—and we are looking only at probability vortices, not actual predictions—that your people will not only be able to live out their current incarnations here but that there will be enough energy within third density to maintain third-density bodies and the energies of evolution, in terms of the spirit, for some of your time, perhaps as many as a hundred or a hundred and fifty of your years.


At a first glance this seems to confirm the gradualist point of view.
However, when you look at the actual wording...


enough energy within third density to maintain third-density bodies [...] in terms of the spirit [...] perhaps as many as a hundred or a hundred and fifty of your years.


Whoa! That's pretty significant, isn't it? Q'uo says that we'll inhabit our spirit bodies, not our physical bodies. Does that mean that we'll leave our physical plane of existence? Open for interpretation.
These kinds of ambiguities drown this particular topic to the point of being unable to deny either the sudden or gradualist point of view. I think they do this very consciously, probably to avoid infringing on our free will. That always tends to be the reason for not giving us the full picture.

My personal view is the sudden event point of view, for numerous reasons:

1. Ra pinpoints the year 2011. If this was a gradual event there wouldn't be a need to pinpoint any specific year.
2. It looks like our world is accelerating exponentially into something as we get closer and closer to Ra's 2011 date. If this was a gradual process, you'd expect more of a linear unfolding of events.

I hope this sheds some light on it.

[Berry Chastain]

Kristy,
There has been an ongoing disagreement regarding your question above about whether the shift will be a spontaneous event or a gradual change. In Davids blog 2012 Politics 1-Grand Overview he discusses his oppinion that the shift will be a somewhat instantaneous event. Please read the whole discussion but for an answer, scroll down near to the bottom of the blog to a section entitled What Actually Happens In 2012. Here is the link to that blog.
http://divinecosmos.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=404&Itemid=70

Hope this is some help.

[MarkM]

Okay, well there is one thing I don't really understand: By classifying yourself as a wanderer, indigo, or w.e you want to call yourself, aren't you embracing individualism and segregating yourself from the oneness of essence? What's the point

This is a good question, and I would address it by suggesting that oneness of essence aside, we are still dealing with being here, with all it's attendant multiplicity of being. I wouldn't think of it as 'embracing' segregation, as the journey home is the main thrust for all within the infinite diaspora of souls. IMO, this is not an individual pursuit, and there is implicit in the journey the wonder of discovery and illumination - perhaps the whole point of the creator having chosen to explore 'manyness'!

Interesting point of discussion, though! Mark

[Ali Quadir]

The point is dual I presume..

First of all by forgetting all, in essence they bring nothing but potential to the surface of the planet. So anything that the wanderer uses to build himself from on earth is earth in origin. Any effect he has on earth is in essence earth itself influencing itself. The wanderer is in a sense only a conduit for potential. He does not bring down karmic connections to of world situations potentially entangling earth with complications from outside of it.

Secondly and I have said this before. But it is my opinion that most if not all wanderers are not here on purely altruistic motives. Everything is synchronistic. In essence by becoming earthling it is possible to dip his consciousness in the consciousness of earth. Thereby becoming more than he was before. Perhaps it allows for experiences that the wander felt he or his people needed or it is a way to redeem for past mistakes. I don't think there's a singular purpose.

The point is exactly segregating from unity, and entering the individual. It has to be, why otherwise do it? For me personally the wanderer mission has always been. Be Human! We need to engage in some karmic bonds on earth in order to complete the connection. Without the connection we might as well not be here and instead look through telescopes from mars.

Obviously we must not go overboard. It requires the middle path. Exactly like any other human being. It's the same boat. The same people. No benefits.

Perhaps there are more reasons there probably are thousands :)

[Makaveli512]

Pretty good responses, but isn't being human enough individualism? Must we decorate ourselves, we all find selflessness and sfo to be very gratifying; what does the term wanderer, for example, do for a person? Don't we have enough roles to play? No hard feelings, I'm just being real here. Real and a bit confused :p

[Deambor]

I agree with most above ideas. I often wonder why we are so obsessed, or maybe, intriged is a better word, with the concept of being a wanderer. Wanderer or not, why does it matter? As Ali says, we all here to live a human experience and be human. While here en carne, we'll never know whether we are wanderers or not. THe rest is guess work.

Love to you folks

[ETguy]

Okay, well there is one thing I don't really understand: By classifying yourself as a wanderer, indigo, or w.e you want to call yourself, aren't you embracing individualism and segregating yourself from the oneness of essence? What's the point

I'd just like to make an interesting side note to this, which is that it seems to me that what we think of as Indigo children and Wanderers are not the same thing.
An Indigo child is basically a 4th density Wanderer with dual bodies (they have both 3rd and 4th density bodies at the same time). This means that when the Earth finally flips over to 4th density, the Indigo child will be able to continue existing on 4D+ Earth. Importantly, this dual body system gives the Indigo child "paranormal" abilities right now on 3D Earth. This explains how there are more and more children who can do things like bending spoons and so forth - they do this through their 4th density body.

A "plain" Wanderer, however, tends to be from the 5th or 6th density. This type of Wanderer inhabits only one ordinary 3rd density human body. While this type of Wanderer is usually an adult in the physical body at this time, Indigo children tend to be just what they sound like - children. I think the early/mid 90's is the cutoff point where Indigo children started appearing instead of 5th/6th density Wanderers. This type of Wanderer will return to its home density when 3D Earth ends and 4D+ Earth begins, which is why they don't have dual bodies.

I'd like to point out that this is basically my own opinion on the subject. Don't take it as fact, your opinion is as good as mine.


By classifying yourself as a wanderer, indigo, or w.e you want to call yourself, aren't you embracing individualism and segregating yourself from the oneness of essence? What's the point

The world is not black and white - but filled with colors. A Wanderer is far from spiritually complete, which is what you are assuming. A Wanderer is at 3D Earth for a purpose at this time just as native 3D earthlings are. A Wanderer is further along this palette of colors towards an understanding of Oneness, however.

[Air-Wick]

I've been thinking about this for a long time now, and I've really been studying this and trying to find some answers.

And well, I've read all of the Law of One material, I've taken into account everything that has been said about wanderers, and what their overall purpose is for the planet

But during the harvest, would the wanderers here now incarnated for 3D experience shoot back up to their original density before entering 3D, or would they go on the path to 4D and so on?

I like to believe that they shoot back up to their original density, but I'm just interested in what everyone thinks about this?


Answers are much appreciated.


- Eric


(Sorry, i tried posting a topic, but i got put in this old topic about the same question. Sorry again!)

[ETguy]

But during the harvest, would the wanderers here now incarnated for 3D experience shoot back up to their original density before entering 3D, or would they go on the path to 4D and so on?
Wanderers return to their home density after third density space/time completion, also known as "the end" in layman's terms. There are a few 4D Wanderers, commonly known as Indigo Children, who possess dually activated 3D/4D bodies. They will continue their evolution on 4D+ Earth after the Harvest. 5D and 6D Wanderers, who tend to be quite a bit older, possess only a 3D body at this time. This 3D body will perish, the Wanderer will then move to time/space, and subsequently return to its home density.

There is an exception for Wanderers who have incurred significant karmic bonds on themselves, however. If these Wanderers are unable to balance this karma before the end, they will need to return to another 3D planet in order to eliminate these karmic bonds. When this is completed the Wanderer can finally return to its home density.

Note: If you are a Wanderer, and life seems to be treating you unfair right now, it's very likely bad karma coming back to you. But it's better to clear it out now, so that you can leave during the Harvest with a clean slate, than having to return for another 25000 year long 3D cycle. Watching My Name Is Earl is comforting. :)

[TheChosen]

Yes.. 5th and 6th density wanderers go to the home frequency .. but.. if you are a wanderer then your karma should be your number one priority .. unless you'd like to 'enjoy' 3D for who knows how many more cycles.

Also beware from attacks of the negative polarity. They will attack mainly in areas where you can hurt your karma and eventually lose your ability to go home. In my personal opinion.. the wanderers are their priority targets. A successfully 'captured' wanderer can be used to many ends (for example for hidden access to higher knowledge and spiritual power).

[Dave C]

Where do i start....
I i am wondering if anyone has any knowledge about wanderers in realtion to the 'harvest' and where the graduating wanderer we going after the harvest ie thos graduating from 3rd density Earth natives would be going presumably to 4th density earth, but would the wanderer go back to their place of origins or what (carry on through 4th desnirt maybe)
I have my own opinions based on what peole have said, but theres' so many opinions on what is even going to happen, and if there is even going to be the 'harvest' scenario... well lets jsut say in reference to the Ra scenario then... I prefer to go with the more exotic theories about what could simply because cause they sound good!! it's quite amazing to me that all this could even happen, i have to say to myself: this sounds to good to be true, but that would be the conditioning saying that negativity is the norm and positivity is the expection... from my perspective (intelectually) that is actually backwards, limitatation and linearity are the expection, and just a tiny fraction of whats availble as an experience... 0.005 or something like that... thats amazing!
Actually i don't 'go with' any theories, i just look at the imformation objectively and weigh it against everything else i've seen.

I've also come across a couple of articles and books etc that state that the harvesting process is actually based on the collective of all the lives lived in 3rd density, insted of just this life, and that detrmines ones overall, frequency and where that will take them...
i would love to know more about this. How would the wanderer fit into all this...
i've got many of my own assumptions, just wandering if any one can expand on these concepts :cool:

[Pilkington]

Where do i start....
I i am wondering if anyone has any knowledge about wanderers in realtion to the 'harvest' and where the graduating wanderer we going after the harvest ie thos graduating from 3rd density Earth natives would be going presumably to 4th density earth, but would the wanderer go back to their place of origins or what (carry on through 4th desnirt maybe)
I have my own opinions based on what peole have said, but theres' so many opinions on what is even going to happen, and if there is even going to be the 'harvest' scenario... well lets jsut say in reference to the Ra scenario then... I prefer to go with the more exotic theories about what could simply because cause they sound good!! it's quite amazing to me that all this could even happen, i have to say to myself: this sounds to good to be true, but that would be the conditioning saying that negativity is the norm and positivity is the expection... from my perspective (intelectually) that is actually backwards, limitatation and linearity are the expection, and just a tiny fraction of whats availble as an experience... 0.005 or something like that... thats amazing!
Actually i don't 'go with' any theories, i just look at the imformation objectively and weigh it against everything else i've seen.

I've also come across a couple of articles and books etc that state that the harvesting process is actually based on the collective of all the lives lived in 3rd density, insted of just this life, and that detrmines ones overall, frequency and where that will take them...
i would love to know more about this. How would the wanderer fit into all this...
i've got many of my own assumptions, just wandering if any one can expand on these concepts :cool:

Good points, I am aware that the idea you get about Wanderers from RA is that their work will be done here and they can go home, I think that will be true if that is how you feel...

I know that more than anything I absolutely burn with intense excitement for being a part of THIS place especially post shift, almost entirely for the new 4th density progression of this realm.
I have had dreams and visions deeply illustrating that my role is along those lines. The 4th dimension of this realm will be all about everything we are here, all the coolest things will finally have a chance to REALLY be explored and expanded upon.
I was shown a picture of a crop circle in a dream once (6 months ago), the circle was of the Mayan calendar, there was a being giving me a message.
They were pointing to a line across the calendar that was the shift point. "You see this?" they asked, "everybody is so focused on everything BEFORE this, they cannot see beyond it. Beyond this is really what it is all about for you, you cannot comprehend how unbelievably amazing it is beyond this (shift point), it is like your life begins after this, like you are just being born."

It was one of the most amazing messages I have ever had, and it makes sense in relation to everything I have been guided to focus on in my life.

Basically, I think whatever you feel is where you will go... not like effort, but if you are excited to be a part of the new realm here, I would imagine that is exactly where you will go.

Probably some of the Wanderers feel like they want the relief of returning home, I know Scott Mandelker spoke of resonating with this feeling.

I am sure we will have plenty of great visits from all the higher dimensional wanderers who return home. The illusion of separation will never be greater than it has been here over the previous millennia... glad to see it rapidly evaporating right before our eyes.

[Abra]

Good points, I am aware that the idea you get about Wanderers from RA is that their work will be done here and they can go home, I think that will be true if that is how you feel...

I know that more than anything I absolutely burn with intense excitement for being a part of THIS place especially post shift, almost entirely for the new 4th density progression of this realm...

I am sure we will have plenty of great visits from all the higher dimensional wanderers who return home. The illusion of separation will never be greater than it has been here over the previous millennia... glad to see it rapidly evaporating right before our eyes.

Thanks, Pikington. I really appreciate what you have said here.

There are many awakened and awakening Wanderers here, now. And we are participating in co-creating the New World. This primarily is what we came here to do, and quite probably what we have done in other worlds as well. Our simple remembering of what we know at our 'Oversoul' level is greatly assisting the many, many members of the Confederation that are assisting with the planetary process at this time. We are, indeed, the Ones we have waited for (to use a common phrase). Not one of us is a "Messiah". We each are here to simply play a role.

Many of us have had hundreds of lives in service to Planet Earth. Some of us only a few. Undoubtedly, we all have some Karmic balancing to complete, but in the end, simply being here and remembering who/what we are, opening to remember our gifts, serves tremendously. The more grounded and connected we are here in the Earth plane and energy grid, the more our remembering goes directly into service to the planet and to the One. I am choosing to place almost no focus upon where I will "go" next. Rather, I am choosing to thoroughly enjoy this being here now Moment.

Now, I have met many who are in a great hurry to get off the planet; they can't wait for what comes next. The longing to return Home is great, so great in fact, some are losing their ability to serve. I want to simply encourage all who read this to remember that we create the life we have, the possibilities are endless, and we are privileged to be here in a body right now. Recall that many millions, perhaps billions of souls wanted to be here now. There was a sort of Spiritual Hierarchy in place that allowed us to be "placed in a body", for our Learn/Teaching.

There has been this idea that the planetary birthing would have to be difficult. Let me just say this is an idea generated by the mind, and not from the heart. Many will choose a difficult experience, but this is just catalyst for the learning, for getting One's own attention. This is to be honored and cherished. We may also choose our learning and remembering through ways that do not necessarily entail pain or suffering.

As shown in Pikington's dream, there is so much yet to come, that 2012 is just a stepping off point so to speak, and the possibilities/probabilities that lie just beyond are quite unimaginable at this point.

Hoo-rah! :D
Abra

[evolving]

The Wanderer
I AM where I AM.
I, as I have always been able to, choose where I desire to go and be.
I desire to remove distortion to speed my time in returning to the One Creator.
I have understanding of a people that need my help.
I understand that returning to a third density quickly removes distortion.
I enter into contract to be of service by bringing love, light, and my special talent.
I incarnate as many times, as my contract is for, on the planet of these people.
I fulfil my contract, finishing the incarnate experiences as per the contract.
I desire to remove distortion to speed my time in returning to the One Creator.
I, as I have always been able to, choose where I desire to go and be.
I AM where I AM.

[RayneboWolf]

Your so right !
This has been my contention, that yes we are aware and even feel changes upon us and we focus on this knowing that we must be in a place of compassion and love to achieve our 4th density bodies.So it is also a challenging time as we are becoming more and more attuned to ascension along with that comes the attacks from many directions.Not only does being put into a defensive position (and therefore focused away from the shift)create emotions of a negative kind but those emotions also thwart the growth of DNA and can actually destroy it.
As for creating what we wish to be ,how delicious is that idea :D
There is already much testing upon us and i firmly do see that those who persevere shall prevail against all odds.The amount of effort we put in and through strength of will and commitment to service to others we are an unstoppable and powerful force of ONE .


Yes.. 5th and 6th density wanderers go to the home frequency .. but.. if you are a wanderer then your karma should be your number one priority .. unless you'd like to 'enjoy' 3D for who knows how many more cycles.

Also beware from attacks of the negative polarity. They will attack mainly in areas where you can hurt your karma and eventually lose your ability to go home. In my personal opinion.. the wanderers are their priority targets. A successfully 'captured' wanderer can be used to many ends (for example for hidden access to higher knowledge and spiritual power).

[7Sisters]

Your so right !
This has been my contention, that yes we are aware and even feel changes upon us and we focus on this knowing that we must be in a place of compassion and love to achieve our 4th density bodies.So it is also a challenging time as we are becoming more and more attuned to ascension along with that comes the attacks from many directions.Not only does being put into a defensive position (and therefore focused away from the shift)create emotions of a negative kind but those emotions also thwart the growth of DNA and can actually destroy it.
As for creating what we wish to be ,how delicious is that idea :D
There is already much testing upon us and i firmly do see that those who persevere shall prevail against all odds.The amount of effort we put in and through strength of will and commitment to service to others we are an unstoppable and powerful force of ONE .

I've have found as I have been moving out of duality that the only emotion that has any true effect on me is happiness. Pain, anxiety, sadness have not been able to 'stick' on me like before...and people who carry this frequency push me away like different poles of magnets pushing on each other.
Yes I do love to help others, and do often, however, I find that those that enjoy living with negativity 'constant complaining' when there is no need to...push me away naturally, where as I don't feel bad if I can't help them because I realize that they don't want it when they act like they do. Even if I am not near them, I can 'feel ' their opposite polarity.

[nephrenka]

Hey 7sisters,i just had to reply to this.Those people are Vampires,let me explain cause i can hear the laugh's now.There are Emotional Vampires,those are the one syou speak of.Then we have the Casuality Vampires,which are just as bad.All these people do is steal your prescious energy,the only way to respond to these creatures is to be cold an lack of caring...It does keep them at bay. peace an good thougts 7sister..

[Abra]

The Wanderer
I AM where I AM.
I, as I have always been able to, choose where I desire to go and be.
I desire to remove distortion to speed my time in returning to the One Creator.
I have understanding of a people that need my help.
I understand that returning to a third density quickly removes distortion.
I enter into contract to be of service by bringing love, light, and my special talent.
I incarnate as many times, as my contract is for, on the planet of these people.
I fulfil my contract, finishing the incarnate experiences as per the contract.
I desire to remove distortion to speed my time in returning to the One Creator.
I, as I have always been able to, choose where I desire to go and be.
I AM where I AM.


Thank you so much for sharing this powerful post. You are seeing yourself and your desires so very clearly.

I would like to offer a prayer I was "given" on 10/21 during a meeting with my interdimensional team:

I AM One
I AM Two
I AM Three
And on this path of continuum is the loving surrender
The Hand of God

So much of my/our learning comes in the simple surrender, and remembering.

With Infinite gratitude to the One,
Abra

[LeeEllisMusic]

This thread caught my eye and has brought up a lot of issues for me. I’ve always known that this is not my home planet...Connections with the Angelic realm, vague memories of spiraling down through the dimensions and star systems to be here now… A great teacher once told me I came in on “someone else’s passport” - and that I would have to figure out the details on my own! I know that I have been through many awakenings, and transitions so profound some may call them “walk-ins” or “soul merges”… I say - - “Whatever”! :)

I had never heard of the term “wanderer” until I stumbled upon this site some months back. What I do know is that I am here to uplift and inspire, and the deep and ancient longing to “go home” is mercifully being replaced with a sense of excitement and even joy at being here at this time in Earth’s history. In fact, a year or so ago, that longing for home was so profound that another switch/ merge occurred, and a new surge of - well, how can you describe a “more-ness” of your own soul? Except to say that Purpose and Well Being seem to have the upper hand these days, in my personal experience. Happiness in each unfolding moment has overcome fear of the “future”… of how things will play themselves out. My deepest intuition says it’s all gonna be alright.

Several questions on this thread regarding what happens to wanderers at the harvest - i.e. getting stuck in karma, having to stay another 25,0000 years - being “captured” - Oh dear, that can instill such fear! My heart says “Not True” - at least for me - and my experience has been one of Divine Protection, Blessings and Grace for all of this particular incarnation, despite some very real and very human hardships.

I feel instinctively that these ages of preparation for my being here, to merge here, to awaken here - it’s all about what is happening NOW. It’s something I consciously chose to experience and have gone through a great deal to achieve. And it’s ALL about LOVE. Fear is something I can no longer afford to call a companion. Done with that :)

The waves of Love, Bliss and Unexpected Compassion that overwhelm me more and more these days, tells me that I am evolving, and yet becoming more of what I already AM. Trying to figure it all out seems less important than being clearly IN the present moment, and extending Hope and promoting Unity Consciousness to all I meet… As Saint Padre Pio said, “Pray, Hope and Don’t Worry”!

This, of course, is just *my* experience. Everyone has their own. Actually, it never occurred to me that I might just up and re-appear “home” on 12/21/2012. My gut says, that’s when the fun really gets going - and I choose to stay and be a vital part of it. Actually I would miss my “Earth” friends and family to be honest. And this beautiful Earth, Gaia… oh, how beautiful she is, and will be again even moreso as we help restore her vast and nurturing glories. I don’t remember “home” really, as much more than a longing, a state of perpetual kindness and gentility and adventure and possibility. I have an image of God/ Source as feeling much closer there - but that’s just an illusion, right? God is as close to “me” now as ever - it’s just the awareness of connection to/ manifestation of Source on the higher dimensions is so much clearer, the veil that much thinner… I couldn’t give “home”s” coordinates on a grid if that’s what you want to know :) Could I just up and go home this very moment - yes - I do my best not to be too attached. Would I rather stay here and take the bump up to the next level and see where that leads? Why not! As Dorothy said in Oz- “But we’ve come so far ALREADY!” - LOL Let me see what’s around the bend here - and see how I can pitch in!

As this one of my first posts, a sense of trepidation might have kept me from posting such personal and intimate information. But I feel safe here - among other wanderers, seekers, other awakening aspects of The ONE… Thanks for that... For being in a welcoming space and holding that space for those who are yet to find us…

And most of all, thank you David Wilcock - for all that you do to Educate and to inspire Hope in these confusing times. I appreciate the science, and moreso, your constant reminders to turn WithIN - for our own wise counsel, for our sacred connection to each other - and to Source.

Blessings… and a very Happy New Year to us ALL!

[HigherLove]

I’ve always known that this is not my home planet...

My friend, as you know, I have felt the same way. It is nice to see you, here. Thank you for bringing David's "work" to my attention.

Namasté

Troy