Jesus

[Understanding]

jesus had many teachings...i remember in the bible it says if you commit blasphemy of the holy spirit it is the unforgiveable sin....so if one does this what is the point of their exsistence?

[moderator: please note that jesus did not say "if you commit blasphemy of the holy spirit it is the unforgiveable sin"]

[SuperManny]

the only "unforgivable sin" imho, is the type where the 'sinner' has not risen above the event, i.e. doesn't feel sorry; would do it again, etc.

i don't believe that any single act; blasphemy, etc. could never be forgiven for eternity, especially if the person would see the error of their ways, and not do it anymore.

[MarkM]

from what i have gathered of jesus' teachings, one of the concepts he was trying to get across to us is that no man has the right to judge another (remember, "let the blameless among you cast the first stone").

i suppose that harlotry was considered in those days as being blasphemy, and the young lady in question was certainly worthy of his forgiveness.

much of the old testament teaching was in reality a human engendered social/legal system. as these systems were heavily in place at the time of the advent of jesus, (systems in which the concept of mercy had no place) he had the 'audacity' to challenge this rigid, unforgiving system, and try to augment it with the mercy concept.

this 'blasphemy' of jesus' is what in part led to his crucifixion.

one of the joys of spiritual seeking in the present day of 'revealing' is to discover that there is no condemnation from a spiritual standpoint. god is infinitely forgiving and patient, and will give us an eternity, if necessary, to overcome our so-called shortcomings and grow at our own speed.

from this you can infer that you need have no fear of god, and indeed, have no fear whatsoever for your immortal soul. we are all guaranteed a place at his side! all paths are acceptable to the one infinite creator!:d :d :d

yours in love and forgiveness, mark

[soup]

possibly this could brush on a relationship triad:
the church, the holy spirit, and mary.

my impression is that at some point "the church"
subordinated the role of "mary" in their practice.
if there is some important relationship between
"mary" and "the holy spirit", then there could be
some glint of blasphemy there.

so it seems possible that "organizations"
like "individuals" may see the error of their
ways and not do it anymore, congruent with
a repentant attitude (i.e. in harmony with
christian teachings.)

[SpiralCycle]

a sin is an action out of free will that bars us from the highest love/god/nirvana/the source ect ect. the more bars we put up against what could be termed as meditation the more we sin or fall away from him. meditation meaning the highest awareness of the highest self; omnipresent and unnattched which usually brings the highest love possible. no one can eternally fight the source of thier being and all will eventually return to god's kingdom "nirvana" because it is our natural state that we have forgotten hence "the fall from eden".

jesus was completely in tune with the source or god. some have seen "god's kingdom" and have put most of thier entitys into it but jesus eventually became one with it completely in human form.

[Kris]

[quote=understanding;22901]jesus had many teachings...i remember in the bible it says if you commit blasphemy of the holy spirit it is the unforgiveable sin....so if one does this what is the point of their exsistence?]

dear understanding

your question has caused a great deal of thinking on my part. i have been filled with anxiety and fear since you first posted it five days ago.

you are quite right, jesus did say in mark and in matthew that blasphemy against the holy spirit is the unforgiveable sin. because this has caused me so much anxiety, i have done a lot of reading on this subject and i believe that what was meant by this was in regard to the fact that the pharisses publicly credited satan for jesus' miracles at that time. therefore, i believe that you would actually have to think of jesus as evil in order to not be forgiven.

the fear your question caused me personally was that since the law of one truly resonates with me, (and i am new to this) does that mean that according to the bible i am rejecting christ and thereby may possibly burn in hell for eternity.

i realize that what i have been going through has been a catalyst to deal with my fear issues (of which i have a few). my father became a "born again christian" when i was 13 years old and so you can only imagine the fears that have been instilled in me.

i would much rather believe in a philosophy that is not fear based, where there is no such thing as eternal damnation, only many lifetimes of opportunities to get things right and be of service to others as we make our way through the densities back to him.

[Art]

...so you can only imagine the fears that have been instilled in me.

i would much rather believe in a philosophy that is not fear based, where there is no such thing as eternal damnation, only many lifetimes of opportunities to get things right and be of service to others as we make our way through the densities back to him.

well done kris. :d i've been "preaching" more or less to those who bring up the topic - close friends, colleagues - usually "disgruntled" christians. i wouldn't ever claim to understand how the religion of christianity grew to what it is today, but there are many examples throughout history of where "the powers that be" have withheld and polluted the true teachings, the true meanings, just to "rule" with fear. not to mention the pervisions of "the church" throughout history, including paying priests to be "forgiven" and the horribly sick things priests do today and the church seemingly tolerates!

this isn't to say that every church is "bad". however, i do believe there is "close-mindedness" and even hippocracy in how there members think and act.

i don't know what all the true meanings of christianity are, but i prefer to focus on how jesus lived his life - as an instrument of "god", one who loved all - in service to others, ultimately leading to his sacrifice, resurrection, and ascension. and, i always keep in mind that the bible is a collection of stories and an omission of others, translated many times throughout history to what it is today. man wrote the stories, man determined what to "leave in" and what to "take out", or withhold. there are divine truths within it, but in my opinion, the bible is not the whole story.

jesus exists inside me - inside each and every one of us. i too am a student of the law of one. there is no conflict. jesus "injected" love into this world, so that the "game" could progress and we could experience what we are today. many other "masters" have brought miracles to this world. religion to me is a man-made institution of moral instruction. i try to take the best from each and merge these ideas, but wouldn't claim to be a member of any church. however, my spirituality is personal - a personal connection to the source of all that is - the one. there are no rules, no dogmatic codes - just the choice of whether i too want to be an instrument of "god" - i have the free will to do so. to me, that is the true essence of this "spiritual evolution" that we are all participating in - the yearning for understanding, purpose...for truth.

its is so great to be experiencing these times, both as participant and observer. to know there are others out there having the same questions and experiences brings me comfort. there is nothing to fear - we are, after all, human, and can make mistakes along the way. you never "learn" by getting it right the first time - you learn through mistakes. so take comfort in all that you do - experiencing the catalysts for growth. advancing our capabilities for forgiveness, compassion, love. these are the "christ" qualities. you're perfect the way you are. in the eyes of the creator. and in the eyes of jesus. :d

art

p.s. - in a previous discussion with christian friends (prior to joining this forum, loo awareness, etc.), they were fearful of "judgement" and "the end of the world", etc. from memory, parts of what i said to them then - "there will be a second coming of jesus. but, it will not come from outer space, or the heavens, etc. jesus will not suddenly appear before you. it will come from within each and every one of us. a bright light will begin to grow inside our hearts and eventually burst through, signaling the arrival of universal love. you have a choice - to choose love, or not to. and you should choose now..." remarkably, this description is analgous to "green-ray activation" (per my understanding) as described in the loo transcripts... refreshing.

[MarkM]

a concept of unforgiveable sin in this biblical regard may originate more with the 1st and 2nd century chroniclers of the life and times of jesus, filtering the memory of jesus' words through their own pre-conceived notions of a limit to the patience and forgivability of god.

we now understand that there are those who actively learn mastery of the garnering and manipulation of universal light/love energy, purposefully inverting, as it were, the application of this energy in order to gain power and control over others. these are they that aspire (consciously knowing or otherwise) to fourth density negative.

i would expect that there are some horrible experiences in store for these individuals, especially as they enter at the bottom of the pecking order, and may have to endure some semblance of damnation in a topsy-turvy world of dominating and being dominated for what may seem to be an eternity, or as long as it takes to reach sixth density.

i suspect that those big time power brokers of earth who are at least ninety five percent service to self have a real fear of fourth density negative, and this might indeed explain such things as the montauk project and other attempted means of forestalling their own harvest from 3d earth.

kris, our fear issues are an opportunity to heal old wounds and shine the light of understanding on dimly lit corridors of ourselves. those things which we fear in the night are seen in the light of day to be nothing more than the shadow of an old tree branch casting an eerie shadow on our bedroom wall.

ask your own higher self for guidance on these matters, and take this opportunity exorcize old 'demons'. the only thing to fear is fear itself.

-mark

[billybobbutterball]

hi guys. as it happened i just sent a private message that addresses some of the questions raised on "our" jesus thread. the person i'm addressing below has been busy defending his anglican position on another thread contained on the atheistically-oriented site of the ultra hard-line evolutionist, richard dawkins. :p :)

most interesting discussions on r.d. ... of course, considering the law of confusion, not much can be accomplished one way or the other by either side in the way of altering the concepts of each other. :confused:

however, i thought that the highly intelligent "jerome" -- as a theistic true believer --should take a look at the law of one, etc,

from: skykieng
to: jerome

hi, jerome. glad to hear that you and your wife are surviving the uk floods!

i had suggested that you go to llresearch.org and do a search under jesus/christ. i took my own advice and went for another look-see. below my preamble is section from one example that i find very interesting.

first:

during the process of studying myself out of christianity i became convinced that the story details of jesus was so flawed that it could only be reconciled by evoking the mythological explanation. the usual argument against that would be that there was not enough time to allow the myth to form,(w.g.t. shedd, dogmatic theology 1884 ) but considering that myths were already in place they could in fact be utilized and built upon -- so to me it seemed that the classical apologetic of shedd was effectively side-stepped.

when i encountered the ra material and its spin-offs i had to further readjust my thinking about the person and work of this jesus. however this development did not send me scurrying back to the established church with hat in hand.

from other channelings it seems that "jesus" came as a wanderer from the highest upper gradient of the positive 4th dimension. in fact this very same social memory complex had also been involved in such earlier ventures as the figure of krishna and budhism. ( the 4th dimension is one of extreme love to the point of sacrifice -- but sans the particular wisdom/knowledge that comes in the 5th and 6th. ) of interest is that the personality of jesus is not now involved with the earth, per se. that social memory complex is entering into the 5th. the christ aspect is of course an altogether different case and not limited to a particular "individual". one complication in trying to unravel all of these comings and goings is that the 3rd is in space/time while the higher ones are in time/space ...and there are parallel time lines to really confuse things! (one might venture that "time is so that everything doesn't seem to be happening at once":cool: )

i might point out that according to the philosophy given by the ra we are under a "law of confusion" which is designed to protect our apparant and most vital freedom of will. thus it is virtually impossible to "irrefutably prove" some types of touchy informational facts. (there is a modest example of that reservation given below)

"the knotty question of just who/what the q'uo "is" has been recently featured on the divinecosmos.com discussion group -- which i have contributed to. also i have added my two-bits worth to a discussion concerning pantheism -- whether or not that designation fits the "law of one"... which i argue against ... if you visit divine cosmos you can recognize me as a certain billybobbutterball.


the perfect life

(q’uo, december 14, 1986)

i am q’uo and i greet you in the love and in the light of the one infinite creator, in whose name and in whose service we answer your call. we greet each of you this evening and thank you for the privilege of being allowed to share our thoughts with you. we urge you as always to remember that we offer our personal opinions and our beliefs, not infallibility. therefore, listen to us in good will, but lay down those thoughts that do not seem helpful.

we find that in speaking about the subject of jesus the christ, we must be more careful than usual to guard against infringement upon free will, for this entity is centrally important to some of those present, and we wish our words not to be stumbling blocks nor to be paths into an unproductive wilderness but rather helpful disclosures for neutral information. there are some levels of understanding above that which you in third density enjoy which are necessary for the grasp of the full nature of jesus the christ, for you who seek this entity shall be in part a mystery to the conscious mind, not because there was an intention to be mysterious, but because the nature of christ is mystery.

the entity known as jehoshua, whom greeks called jesus, or rather, jesu, was born closely upon the heels of midsummer, very few years before that year suggested by your histories, approximately five and one-half years. we believe this is the correct measurement. we are sorry, but your numbering does not make enough sense to us. we understand your moons, but not your numbers.

we cannot speak about what this instrument calls the virgin birth, and invoke the law of confusion, saying only that each new soul first awakened to its perception of itself as an eternal being has experienced the virgin birth.

the event was difficult and the birth was indeed humble, though brightened by an optical illusion, shall we say, a most unusual configuration within the heavens which caused there to appear to be for some of your months an unusually bright cluster of light in the night sky. the combination of the christ with a serviceable life channel was powerful, and many psychic events occurred before and after the event as well as at the time of it. astrologer kings did indeed journey following the star; however, the arrival was approximately a year and a half later. that indeed is a spiritual adventure you would do well to ponder as you approach your own stable looking for the newborn, guided by hope, the brightest star of your being.

the entity, jesus, was loved and loved in return, but his mind drove him to be alone. for though too young to have established to his own satisfaction the nature of his being, he had tremendous hunger for wisdom. you would call this entity a child prodigy. the entity taught many, many more things than are written and could continue teaching for an eternity, yet what has been recorded is typical enough of the teaching’s content in general that we do not choose to take this opportunity to adjust the teachings that are recorded. it is not only that there is some infringement upon free will, although that is part of our caution. we also do not wish to sway those who have not become interested in the christ to alter their viewpoints ...

snip

trust you are a speed-reader ...otherwise sorry for so much writings! my best, from the colonies, skykieng, aka bill gieskieng

[Kris]

[quote=art;23008]
this isn't to say that every church is "bad". however, i do believe there is "close-mindedness" and even hippocracy in how there members think and act.]

i agree!

[and, i always keep in mind that the bible is a collection of stories and an omission of others, translated many times throughout history to what it is today. man wrote the stories, man determined what to "leave in" and what to "take out", or withhold. there are divine truths within it, but in my opinion, the bible is not the whole story.]

good point.

jesus exists inside me - inside each and every one of us. i too am a student of the law of one. there is no conflict.

thank you art. that statement alone has offered me great comfort and peace of mind. i appreciate your words of wisdom. it's funny the issues that have been coming up lately for me to deal with that were buried deep inside.

kris

[mitiog]

and jesus said: for i was born to bare witness to the truth. for no one shall come to the father, but through me. what does this mean? it means that only when you understand the truth of the heart that you shall bare witness to the father. for there is nothing that will be or can be more powerful then the love of all which is one.

i felt i had to share this with all, don't know if it makes any sence to you? but it does to me.....and
thank you david wilcock for the message of hope, and all of my love to all of you.

[onething]

the bible does not teach an eternal hell. the word translated as such is aeon. an aeon is an age, a period of time. it comes to an end. he who sins against the holy spirit (knowingly blocking truth??) will not be forgiven for the rest of the aeon, and also the next.

no one need ever fear god at any time! you might want to fear the consequences of your own bad karma, perhaps.

all those who are sincere and of good will really, really should get on with the business of enjoying the growth in understanding provided by our benevolent creator and stop getting caught up in negative scriptures and translations and theology.

"god is light and in him is no darkness at all." epistle of james, i think.
ponder that one.

*****

no one comes to the father except through me.

this is a tough one i have thought about. many scriptures are not original, and are made up and inserted. there's always the possibility he never said it, or didn't say it like that.

but maybe he did. something people forget is that jesus was teaching to only the jews of his time. and the jews of his time, in my opinion, were caught up in a lot of negativity. much of the old testament, if one looks at it honestly, some of it is downright evil and also of course inconsistent. it leaves people utterly confused.

the people that jesus was talking to had no other chance -- except to abandon judaism and go do something else, but they were not going to do that. he was their way out. either they took him as a prophet and allowed him to clean up the negativity or they clung to the negativity. if we remember that he was speaking to a specific group of people at a specific time and he felt he was born to teach them the truth. and what truth was that? if a person actually reads the bible, (and so few do!) you will be struck by how jesus almost desperately tries to light people on fire to love god the way he does, by teaching them a god who is always good, always forgiving, always patient, and loves all unconditionally.

if you read the gospels you will note that most of what jesus is doing is teaching people about the nature of god.

i know this is a strong thing to say but so many of the passages of the old testament, and the actions and sayings attributed to the creator of billions of galaxies are just ridiculous in their pettiness, their meanness, and total inadequacy for the one true god. this negativity came along and infected christianity, i think.

he came to tell them how god really is because the one they called god was very different. this is really important. so - he was their chance to come to the father.
people love to say jesus came to fulfill all the laws but that is nonsense. he came to overthrow them, and teach life lived by the spirit.

[charles obscure]

my take on it is this

-the concept of 'blasphemy against the holy spirit being the unforgiveable sin' -

what i believe is being referred to here is the concept of not accepting the god or holy spirit within ourselves, to not accept ourselves as the creator/god/the holy spirit. this is to blashpeme against the holy spirit, and perhaps is the only offence which guarantees another round of 3d experience.

as far as the statement 'no one comes to the father except through me' this is a statement alluding to the self-sacrifice required to graduate this experience. jesus himself being a symbol of the ultimate sacrifice.

[Young Myrrh Atop the Hill]

blasphemy, in judaica, was/is the "pronunciation of the tetragrammaton (yhvh) in the original, now forbidden manner instead of using a substitute pronunciation such as adonai."

i was personally raised by a loving family of folk-style, evangelical episcopalians (now, anglican). christ has walked beside me, in me, and carried me all of my life. but what i believe is for myself. i study the alice bailey/dk treatises, now. the law of one in content is new to me, however, not in mind.

if christhood is the perfecting of the love/wisdom or intelligent love aspect, associated with the heart chakra (perhaps why jesus is invited into the heart, no?), then there is no need for fear.

"christian" means "little christ." christ love, in personal experience, examines not only the action but the intent within one's heart that lay behind said action. this includes one's quest for truth.

there is much disease in religion and politics. it has been experience that a revelation becomes a prison when one does not continue on into the next revelatory experience. those who would seek to ablolish the free will of the soul, whether in religion or government, are slaves, themselves. power is a most unforgiving master. the richest and most powerful in the world, as we know it, are unfortunately the ones who require love the most. fearing them will help no one. fearing for one's own immortal soul will help no one. but the "love that passeth all understanding," this is what brings change in a person's heart, whatever their pursuits or beliefs.

this is how i reconcile my newer-formed beliefs with the old. harmony through conflict is achieved by love. slavery comes from fear and apetite. if the art of loving brings freedom from fear, may it penetrate all that would seek to restrict the freedom of one's will, individually and en masse.

may love and wisdom guide us all in the times ahead.

[LightEye]

dear friends,

http://stellarhousepublishing.com/jesussunexcerpt.html

be well, be love.

david

jesus as the sun throughout history
by d.m. murdock/acharya s

"the result of the church's encounter with the sun-cults of antiquity was nothing less than the dethronement of helios."

dr. hugo rahner, greek myths and christian mystery (93)

in my books and articles, i present the evidence that many aspects of the gospel story about jesus christ, and of christian tradition in general, represent motifs from older astrotheology and solar mythology, specifically reflecting legends and myths regarding the sun gods of antiquity. there remains much confusion concerning this subject, including erroneous claims that this equation of jesus with the sun only started to be expressed during the 19th century. this contention that connecting jesus to the sun constitutes a "modern" phenomenon is easily demonstrated to be false, through the study of ancient texts, including the bible and works of the early church fathers, as well as christian traditions, rituals, architecture and artifacts. from a wide variety of sources, it is clear that associating, identifying and equating christ with the sun began in ancient times and has continued abundantly over the many centuries since then.

the exploration of christ as a solar figure includes a study of ancient sun worship not only in the pagan world but also in israel, as exhibited by the solar nature of jesus’s purported father, the israelite god yahweh. demonstrating the copious substantiation for israelite sun worship, especially as concerns the main jewish god, in yahweh and the sun: biblical and archaeological evidence for sun worship in ancient israel, rev. dr. j. glen taylor, a theologian and professor of old testament and biblical proclamation at wycliffe college, remarks:

this book is a slightly revised version of my doctoral dissertation entitled "solar worship in the biblical world" which was submitted to the graduate school of yale university in the spring of 1989. as may be judged from the title of that work, i had at one time planned to cover more territory than sun worship in ancient israel, but found the material pertaining to ancient israel so vast that i never got beyond it. (taylor, 7)

[Wolf]

well, i think that charles is on the right track. to answer this question we must first answer the question, "what is sin?"

sin is not doing something bad which some divine parent figure disapproves of. sin is seperation from god. alienation from the divine. to be seperated from the divine within ourselves which is god (the kingdom of heaven is within you).

there is no sin which divinity will not wash away. so then another way in which this teaching has been presented is 'the only sin that cannot be forgiven is the hardening of the heart against god". this is a very very frightening state to consider. i have experienced it myself. it's not that god won't forgive this sin. it's that she cannot. the free will of the hardened heart will not allow it.

it is possible to become so disillusioned and to have our concepts of love, hate, divinity, and evil to be inverted and twisted and tangled around. it's like being a spiritual child and perceiving the parent as an abusive figure. the luciferian experience is to desire love while mistrusting it. it is to reject divinity while longing to be embraced by it. this is a very wounded place. the long dark night of the soul indeed. this is the real hell. when asked where hell was, christ told us "if my father is everywhere, then where is there room for hell? only in the hearts of men where god gives him free will." these teachings are intertwined.

but fear not because all water eventually flows to the see and all that god has created returns unto god eventually.

thank you for reading. namaste.

wolf

[FooSnik]

when asked where hell was, christ told us "if my father is everywhere, then where is there room for hell? only in the hearts of men where god gives him free will."


oh wow. that is powerful.

this statement is yet another example of hypocrisy in the christian religion. how can jesus himself say the above statement and then priests and reverends, who are preaching his word, still say you will go to hell if you don't act right.

it's all about love. lose the politics of religion and you have the simple loving words of a loving man known as jesus christ.

peace :)

[mmariebored]

when asked where hell was, christ told us "if my father is everywhere, then where is there room for hell? only in the hearts of men where god gives him free will."
i'd like to know where this is written, because it's not in any bible i've ever read. perhaps if it were in the bible, the fundamentalists who use fear tactics to secure their audience might not have ever grown to the massive size they did. they'd have had no barbed wire to surround the people's minds.

'onething', great post, i agree.

[leo scone]

um...not going to get involved in discussions of sin (one creation, no sin possible) or the written histories of what was said by who.

be mindful, joseph's tale was much as j.c.'s, and, correct me, but i believe osiris also has a similar tale - 12 followers, being saved by being sent down the river, and other details too similar to be independent of the story told.

the same programming has been being put out since sumerian times. it is a repetitive tale, one written by those who seek social control.

which is not to say that there isn't a ton of good stuff in those tales, just that personal discretion is highly necessary.

there is no set of written words anywhere that should decide what is for people. it is our lives and experiences which are to determine that.

so, to paraphrase the "dude" himself - we are all destined to do greater things. but it will be because we find christ energy within, not because we cater to anybody else's tale, or wait for something to occur outside of our true selves.

and please, do not let this dissuade any from their search. ra sez it, as have so many others - take what resonates with you and seems of value, leave the rest in the dust.

kate bush asks in one of her songs why no one ever painted jesus laughing, and wonders "don't you think he would have a beautiful smile?"

ponder that we are to seek love and joy through the teachings of one they can't even show us smiling and happy.

you are all the beloved, don't wait on anyone else's instructions to live and be that love.

[Truth180]

people who judge one another by their physical features or there choice in belief or their path they choose in life is all part of 3d life here on earth. but for those who do judge someone seem to forget what jesus said.

in the bible it says "for those who have not sinned shall cast the first stone."

we can repharse that and say "for who is perfect shall judge their other selves"
;)




truth 180

[FooSnik]

people who judge one another by their physical features or there choice in belief or their path they choose in life is all part of 3d life here on earth. but for those who do judge someone seem to forget what jesus said.

in the bible it says "for those who have not sinned shall cast the first stone."

we can repharse that and say "for who is perfect shall judge their other selves"
;)




truth 180

i like this thread. some intelligent conversation going on here.

one other hypocrisy in the bible. about judgment. how can the priests and reverends tell us not to judge other people and then turn right around and say that god is going to judge whether or not we can get into heaven? they are basically calling god a hypocrite. like god would have a "do as i say but not as i do" kind of an attitude.

in my opinion, this is a glaring hypocrisy. when i asked a christian friend of mine what his opinion of this matter is his reply was, "he is god. he can do whatever he wants." :rolleyes:

[Wolf]

mmariebored,

you are correct. that is nowhere in the christian bible. there are other sources of christ's teachings. but most importantly, i always tell people that if they want to know what christ has to say, go ask him. the ascended masters are available to everyone, not just prophets. directly accessing the masters is much more reliable than old books that have been reinterpreted by people with agendas. this is something that religious institutions do not want you to believe.

best,

wolf

[Truth180]

i like this thread. some intelligent conversation going on here.
in my opinion, this is a glaring hypocrisy. when i asked a christian friend of mine what his opinion of this matter is his reply was, "he is god. he can do whatever he wants." :rolleyes:

theres a guy i work with who is christian and he has been married two times and now on his third, but at the same time he looks at other people on how they are not faithful or whatever. i bogles my mind on how he don't see it for himself. in reallity though its not what religion they are its what intent they have when they do these things faithful or not i think.

[Rhonda]

this trend is quite interesting, i also enjoyed this post made the other day from lighteye and the information presented on the sun of god and/or son of god., and the various points and relationships made.



http://stellarhousepublishing.com/jesussunexcerpt.html

be well, be love. david

jesus as the sun throughout history
by d.m. murdock/acharya s

"the result of the church's encounter with the sun-cults of antiquity was nothing less than the dethronement of helios."

dr. hugo rahner, greek myths and christian mystery (93)

in my books and articles, i present the evidence that many aspects of the gospel story about jesus christ, and of christian tradition in general, represent motifs from older astrotheology and solar mythology, specifically reflecting legends and myths regarding the sun gods of antiquity. there remains much confusion concerning this subject, including erroneous claims that this equation of jesus with the sun only started to be expressed during the 19th century. this contention that connecting jesus to the sun constitutes a "modern" phenomenon is easily demonstrated to be false, through the study of ancient texts, including the bible and works of the early church fathers, as well as christian traditions, rituals, architecture and artifacts. from a wide variety of sources, it is clear that associating, identifying and equating christ with the sun began in ancient times and has continued abundantly over the many centuries since then.

the exploration of christ as a solar figure includes a study of ancient sun worship not only in the pagan world but also in israel, as exhibited by the solar nature of jesus’s purported father, the israelite god yahweh. demonstrating the copious substantiation for israelite sun worship, especially as concerns the main jewish god, in yahweh and the sun: biblical and archaeological evidence for sun worship in ancient israel, rev. dr. j. glen taylor, a theologian and professor of old testament and biblical proclamation at wycliffe college, remarks:
(taylor, 7)

quote:
when asked where hell was, christ told us "if my father is everywhere, then where is there room for hell? only in the hearts of men where god gives him free will."

i do feel we have the choice to live in heaven on earth or hell on earth everyday.

[mmariebored]

one other hypocrisy in the bible. about judgment. how can the priests and reverends tell us not to judge other people and then turn right around and say that god is going to judge whether or not we can get into heaven? they are basically calling god a hypocrite. like god would have a "do as i say but not as i do" kind of an attitude.

there is hypocrisy in any text, if you ask me, hypocrisy isn't the problem. the problem is, when people read a book that was written ages ago and expect it to be perfect because some counsel said it was "god's word".
therein lies the problem in it's entirety.
expecting it to be perfect and believing it's "god's word".
makes no sense.


mmariebored,

you are correct. that is nowhere in the christian bible. there are other sources of christ's teachings. but most importantly, i always tell people that if they want to know what christ has to say, go ask him. the ascended masters are available to everyone, not just prophets. directly accessing the masters is much more reliable than old books that have been reinterpreted by people with agendas. this is something that religious institutions do not want you to believe.

best,

wolf
what boggles me is, if these "masters" were so easily accessibe, why were the slaughters over religions allowed to happen?

why were women burned at the stake by some man claiming to be speaking for "jesus". if jesus was somewhere around, why did he not stop this? it was in his name, right?

perhaps the seth materials are correct in their insinuations that jesus was not so nice. i know i certainly wouldn't allow hundreds of thousands of people, claiming my name, to be slaughtered in an arena by hungry lions. that would be when i made one of the "miracle appearances" to save them from their fate. but i guess appearing to paul and writing a world dominating book was more important than saving all those lives...

no, if he were somewhere i could reach him, i don't think i'd have anything to say to him or ask him. or...perhaps i'd forgive him.

[Wolf]

with all respect, mmariebored, these are questions that you will have to answer for yourself or not answer as you choose. the voice that you select when asking indicates to me that any answer that i could offer you would be coming from outside of your existing paradigm and would therefore have no meaning for you. i wish you the best in your search.

sincerely,

wolf

[mmariebored]

with all respect, mmariebored, these are questions that you will have to answer for yourself or not answer as you choose...
actually, i enjoy the discussion, mainly, and i hope to illuminate different perspectives for everyone reading.

sincerely. :)

[Truth180]

i think jesus was human just like any one else here today. he had human feelings and his doubts i am sure. in my opinion the bible blew it way out of text. the more people talk about a subject the more distorted it gets. people with negative and positive intentions put their own conclusions at that time and through out the centuries in the "good book". its like a tug of war going on.

[onething]

very nice post, leo scone.


when i asked a christian friend of mine what his opinion of this matter is his reply was, "he is god. he can do whatever he wants."

and i have seen this very same reply in response to some much worse things that were supposed to be done by jehovah in the old testament. it is a terrible spiritual misunderstanding. it comes of having an old text written by who knows who and who knows when or why, and then thousands of years later having otherwise decent people think they must find a way to justify the unjustifiable.

it is a completely worldly understanding of divinity. as though god were some sort of big man lording it over us simply because he can, with no spiritual principles, no need to set a consistent example for humanity. like some tyrant.

[Jetamus]

i wonder what the actual ascended master jesus thinks about his name being used as a swear word.

[LordDragon]

there is a difference between the historical jesus and the jesus created by the catholoc church. the historical jesus is a rebel man, he is king of judea only by title and lives in a land ruled by the roman empire. alltough the romans accept different religions like the jewish, jesus and his zelots are not happy with that. ( which could indicate jesus was in fact close to a religieous fundamentalist) this jesus was a man like you and me, he made love to woman, he fights, he is frustrated, he has emotions, ...
the jesus created by the church is a man who has never existed. a man who has no contact with woman, a man who does not sin etc
now you can ask yourself, calling uppon this mythical chatolic jesus, which has never existed, is a logic thing to do? offcourse not, but the church had millions of people over hundreds of years worshipping a man whom had never existed in the way they pictured them. so where is all that energy of prayer going? yeah right nowhere.

wolf wrote


the ascended masters are available to everyone, not just prophets. directly accessing the masters is much more reliable than old books that have been reinterpreted by people with agendas. this is something that religious institutions do not want you to believe.

i agree with you, books can be manipulated, direct contact with our ascended forefathers not.

mmariebored wrote


what boggles me is, if these "masters" were so easily accessibe, why were the slaughters over religions allowed to happen?

why were women burned at the stake by some man claiming to be speaking for "jesus". if jesus was somewhere around, why did he not stop this? it was in his name, right?

first the ascended masters have nothing to do with religion, religion is created by man to oppress other man. and second, in which jesus his name all the killing was done? not in the historical jesus his name but in the fake imaginary jesus created by the church. (so in fact by the church, by humans to other humans, again no ascended masters involved)

the ascended masters are like less dense beings not really able to change or do things in 3d like we do. they do not interfear because of the law of free will; there purpose is to help us find the master in ourselves. so i think there is no point blaming them for what is happening here in 3d, because whats heppening here is because we as humanity allow it to happen, translate we need it, it's our learning proces.


perhaps the seth materials are correct in their insinuations that jesus was not so nice. i know i certainly wouldn't allow hundreds of thousands of people, claiming my name, to be slaughtered in an arena by hungry lions. that would be when i made one of the "miracle appearances" to save them from their fate. but i guess appearing to paul and writing a world dominating book was more important than saving all those lives...

well the romans had a system, the would tolerate you had another faith, if you pay your taxes. the early christians, as we call them refused this, so the followers of christ/jesus create this suffering for themselves. if they had payed the taxes the would not have been seen as a sekt. offcourse jesus plays a role in this because he was the first to stand up against the tax inners, (farizeers), and his followers do as he showed them. but as i said the historical jesus was a rebel man.

did you know buddha was also a rebel? he stood up against his father and the cast system of hindoeism. i believe all these great man are just man like you and me. and this is what the religiuos leaders do not want we know, because if god is to be find in yourself, and if all are god, how are they gonna control the people then?

blessings, ld.

[PriestOfLight]

jesus is not a super being. he is not to be worshipped. he has no special powers. he does not command the world (nor do i believe that he wishes too).

jesus is simply an example of what you can be. what you can aspire to. the level of what we term on this site as spiritual evolution. he came to show he was no different then any other being on this planet. to be ordinary and rise. not to be kingly and rise.

he has simply shown the way to ascension through his efforts on this planet by releasing all fear and embracing love. any of us can do these things and many before have ascended. he was not the first. but he brought the ascension process to the masses. showing there is no death only life. his death and resurrection soon after proves this undeniablly.


love and light

paul

[mmariebored]

there is a difference between the historical jesus and the jesus created by the catholoc church.
technically, there's no actual proof either existed at all. as i've said before, jesus was a very popular name in the days the "christian" one presumably existed, so a story could have been created using that name. i agree with you that if he did in fact exist, he was most likely a rebel, based on the way he was portrayed in the documents as always looking over his shoulder and accusing the scribes and priests etc of being out to get him. i agree with you that "books can be manipulated".


well the romans had a system, the would tolerate you had another faith, if you pay your taxes. the early christians, as we call them refused this, so the followers of christ/jesus create this suffering for themselves. if they had payed the taxes the would not have been seen as a sekt. offcourse jesus plays a role in this because he was the first to stand up against the tax inners, (farizeers), and his followers do as he showed them. but as i said the historical jesus was a rebel man.
i believe this was already thought of when creating the bible, because it was added that he did pay his taxes("render unto caesar...").


and this is what the religiuos leaders do not want we know, because if god is to be find in yourself, and if all are god, how are they gonna control the people then?

blessings, ld.
i'm aware that religion was created as a means to control the people, which is also why i believe that the figures being portrayed as ascended masters might not have ever existed at all. anyone who has experience with meditation and tapping into the other realms knows that there are entities who will lie and call themselves whoever you want them to be called, so long as you listen to them and do as they say(and they love, absolutely love, being called master).


i wonder what the actual ascended master jesus thinks about his name being used as a swear word.

you know, i was thinking hypothetically today about jesus and whether or not he ever existed, as recorded, and i thought about the christian's popular fear of the "antichrist". so, hypothetically, if any of what was written about jesus was true, and based on all the tragedies that happened in his name, maybe the man himself is the "antichrist", come to undo the damage done in his name. perhaps he doesn't like his own name because of all the hype and maybe he made it the swear word it's used as today.

[Alexander]

i wonder what the actual ascended master jesus thinks about his name being used as a swear word.

a friend of mine makes a good point about this. if these was nothing to the man there wouldn't be so much hatred towards him by those who "hate the light", nor would his name been made into a swearword.

perhaps the physical jesus was much like one of us who lived an inspired life, but may not have been "perfect", just knowing the way.

what encompasses the son, the body of christ in the christian religion may be a real thing, but what its composed of, what it really is, might be surprising. labels aside, god is love, and we are a part of him.

i for one, never understood the whole worship thing, but it was revealed to me even in my youth that i was different. i don't judge the people of this world in their actions, for i do not know the cause/meaning behind all their deeds.

is possible the god they worship in such a manner is in need of this, and until the people can grow beyond it, it's what they want, perhaps what they need too.

[FooSnik]

originally posted by jetamus
i wonder what the actual ascended master jesus thinks about his name being used as a swear word.

hmmmm... i wonder how i would feel if people yelled "foosnik!!" every time they stubbed their toe. lol would be a bit weird, that's for sure.

why is it that someone like hitler's name is not used as a curse word. he is the negative one. ironically it is the gentle, loving one that gets used.

does that prove that we hurt the ones we love the most?



so, hypothetically, if any of what was written about jesus was true, and based on all the tragedies that happened in his name, maybe the man himself is the "antichrist", come to undo the damage done in his name. perhaps he doesn't like his own name because of all the hype and maybe he made it the swear word it's used as today.

it's funny you say that. i have just finished some very interesting reading about nostradamus. he saw three antichrists in the future. napoleon was the first. hitler was the second. and the third should be around anytime now.

nostradamus and irish saint malachy both predicted that the final pope would be coming after the one we have now. the final pope will have a close connection with the third antichrist and this connection will bring about the end of the catholic church, according to the profit.

another interesting vision of nostradamus' is that the third antichrist will be defeated by the earth herself. around the estimated year of 2029 there will be an earth shift that will bring about atlantis style flooding and will end the antichrist's bid for world domination. maybe this will take place in what dw calls 4d negative?

but nostradamus said himself that the future is probable and he recorded the worst of his visions for the precise purpose of avoiding them. and it seems like we have had some success with that so far.

[mmariebored]

it's funny you say that. i have just finished some very interesting reading about nostradamus. he saw three antichrists in the future. napoleon was the first. hitler was the second. and the third should be around anytime now.

nostradamus and irish saint malachy both predicted that the final pope would be coming after the one we have now. the final pope will have a close connection with the third antichrist and this connection will bring about the end of the catholic church, according to the profit.

another interesting vision of nostradamus' is that the third antichrist will be defeated by the earth herself. around the estimated year of 2029 there will be an earth shift that will bring about atlantis style flooding and will end the antichrist's bid for world domination. maybe this will take place in what dw calls 4d negative?

but nostradamus said himself that the future is probable and he recorded the worst of his visions for the precise purpose of avoiding them. and it seems like we have had some success with that so far.
i used the term "antichrist" in hypothetical terms because i strongly disbelieve in that group of information. "antichrist" holds no actual value with me, and frankly, i don't see what it could possibly mean in today's terms. if anything, the wide distribution of information over the internet should be considered the "antichrist", and the media or even movies such as "angels and demons" and "religulous". because the term means destruction of the christian christ. people who search out an actual person are wasting time on 'chicken feed'.

[Candide]

hum ? what feels like jesus? then,what feels like y'shua? now, what feelings come with sananda? surely each identity clusters understandings. 3d 4d 5d.

[conundrum]

antichrist" holds no actual value with me, and frankly, i don't see what it could possibly mean in today's terms.

it means those that wish to keep you from your christ light or if you like business .

[mmariebored]

it means those that wish to keep you from your christ light or if you like business .
that's what it means...to you.
i don't call my personal light "christ light", because it's mine. if one were to allow their light to be labeled with a certain name, such as christ, then they give permissions to that group. i prefer to follow my own inner guidance. :)

and you're right, it is your business. my apologies if i offended.

[savant]

that's what it means...to you.
i don't call my personal light "christ light", because it's mine. if one were to allow their light to be labeled with a certain name, such as christ, then they give permissions to that group. i prefer to follow my own inner guidance. :)

and you're right, it is your business. my apologies if i offended.

every vibration has a sound, or rather, is a sound. every sound formed has a name, is a note in the one. the "christ" - or the "word" - is a spiritual vibration which, as jesus' disciple john wrote, was "the true light which lighteth every man (-ifestation of god) which cometh into the world." jesus taught that each soul's "personal light" and origin is the spiritual self anchored in the spiritual plane whom he called the "father" (and "i am") and with whom he also affirmed his oneness and origin. because most of humanity had occluded the inner light to a great degree, by placing the outer ego in it's place, jesus came to restore a lifeline to the "i am" and a universal spiritual path to re-union with it.

the significance of this for ourselves is that jesus openly demonstrated his soul's union with the christ spirit ("the 'word' became flesh") and with the "father", and he exhorted us to do the same (according to our then current understanding). he made the following mystical statements:

"if i go not, i cannot send you the comforter
who will bring all things to your remembrance."

and:

"this is my (light) body which is broken for you."

this means that the christ or the "word" which jesus integrated with is the same christ which we too can integrate with because, as a consequence of his ascension, he was empowered to make the christ spirit available to humanity in a more than ordinary way. he was offering a portion of himself - his greater christ self - as an interior lifeline to the "personal light" of the "father", the i am presence within us. there is really no way to rise (in vibration) from material to spiritual octaves of consciousness except through the inner christ. by making these statements, jesus, one with christ, was offering an individualisation of the christ spirit to each one of us as the mediator (as an interior guide and friend if we would have it) between the soul trapped in the relative ignorance of duality and our "personal light" who is "my father and your father", our true spiritual being.... not as an eternal substitute but until our soul (vibrationally) re-aquaints itself with the "personal light" of the "i am" and again harmoniously resonates with it, as above (in spirit) so below (in matter). "not my will but thine be done". all the same, both are one.

this is the role of the true mediator who "stands" between octaves of consciousness above and below. the christ has the divine vision to see both the imperfections of the soul in matter and the perfection of the "i am" in spirit and is empowered by love to resolve and dissolve the vibrational breach between them. the alchemist - the christ-consciousness - can change the water into wine. the sense of separation from the love of god is a vibrational 'separation'. it is an illusion which can be transmuted as the soul recognises the spiritual vibration within (of the "lost word" within) and surrenders to it's loving guidance and will on the path homeward. with this understanding, which is the essential teaching of jesus the christ, the twain can become one.

david's frequent references to christ-consciousness are worth contemplating too in light of the words of the master jesus. and so are the many excellent 'readings' of edgar cayce.

if you'd like to read anything more about the true mission and message of jesus, just pm me for a good link. thanks.

[Ladan]

"jesus is the way"!!! i never imagined that these words, so often spoken during my years in religious comunity, would have a whole different meaning some day. it was an interesting journey to me...
i was caught up in speculations and dispute about who was jesus, where he came from and similar, but never looking into his message. the church offered very simplified form of his message. basicly, that i am naturally a sinner, and god is so merciful, that he has sent his son to pay for my sins with innosent blood, so if i believe in his sacrifice, i would go to heaven. very secular interpretation, don't you think.
his message is like a loud gong in our history, reminding us of who we really are, our nature and capabilities. and he was not the only one...
this is my understanding now, that we are incredible beings, capable of performing miracles because it is our nature, but somehow with amnesia or caught up in illusion. harold sherman, ingo swann, russel turg, dr. nick begich, elisabeth haich, jesus, buddah.... all tell the greatest story ever told. we are powerfull beings, creating our reality, even if we are not aware of our powers. jesus words to his followers come to mind, that they could do all miracles he was doing and more. telepathy, remote viewing, obe... this is where to me sts and sto comes in. how we use these abilities.
a few good pointers of what kind of miracles we are capable of:

dr. nick begich discussed the latest research on telepathy (part 6 is excelent)
[please pm for link]

harold sherman's "your key to happiness":
http://www.haroldsherman.com/publishedworks/yourkeytohappiness.htm#to_you_who_are_about_to_rea d_this_book_

this is so exciting and uplifting to know that all it takes is to let yourself to believe in such possibilities, no doubt , no fear. i always wandered how a 7 year old dw could do those things. harold sherman showed to me that it is just that easy.
love and light!

[Cosmolaws]

could it wery well mean that sin against the holy spirit is doing something wich you know is sin, and still you do it??

[Happystrings]

when david mentioned that he went to school with jeff sharlet and that jeff had written a best seller about christian fundamentalism, called the family, i listened to the npr interview. after hearing that i decided to go out and buy the book. i had no idea what i was in for. it is a stomach turning expose of details of how this group, with roots going back to the 1730's jonathan edwads have controlled american history...and if you read david's latest blog you know that.

however, what i wasn't ready for was the incredible twists that these men (women are not allowed, except for tea and coffee serving :eek: ) i am having a tough time reading through the whole book as i get disgusted with the deep intrigue and malicious turns that these men engineered to push the usa onto the dark side of world history.

i had only a fuzzy sense of what the phrase "new world order" really meant, since it is a term that is tossed about as if everyone knows what it means. only upon getting into this book did i come upon the beginnings, and meaning, of this phrase.

i find all of this informaiton greatly troubling and i haven't even finished reading the book. has anybody else read this and what insight do you have. i wax between furious and heartbroken that such malicious twists were applied to the christ teachings and used to destroy and enslave so many people. no wonder there are people that revile at the term christ consciousness!

[Deerclan]

i find all of this informaiton greatly troubling and i haven't even finished reading the book. has anybody else read this and what insight do you have. i wax between furious and heartbroken that such malicious twists were applied to the christ teachings and used to destroy and enslave so many people. no wonder there are people that revile at the term christ consciousness!

i have not actually read the book, but i have done my own research and come up with what i believe to be the "family history" of our nation. i see pretty much the same picture as you describe in jeff's book. the only difference is that i see the whole process beginning long before jonathan edwards, a couple of hundred years before in fact. the conflicts within america are actually the conflicts that existed in the family of henry viii of england. so yes, you are right to feel disgusted and, as you express it so eloquently, "wax between furious and heartbroken" over the "malicious twists" in christ's teachings. they have become primarily a club with which to terrorize other people, at least on a societal level of politics & economics. this type of realization might not feel comfortable, but i still say to you - good work! :) the first step in freeing oneself of chains is to become fully aware of them.

paul