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Sunny One
03-23-2002, 09:04 PM
if considering your vulnerability seems trivial,
consider your invulnerability, created by self
imposed barriers or social norms of conduct.

personaly, i stretch these barriers to the max,
and as jeremy pointed out, to such an extreme
level of open honesty that it is uncomfortable.
maybe this violates needs for emotional security.

i stretch my vulnerability to explore the limits
of my freedom. i am a lover of truth and freedom.
barriers to me create separation. separation
is an illusion, if you truly embrace the law of one.
so, open sharing of honest feelings for me are
a harmonious expression of the law of one.

what happens when you stretch yourself, put
yourself in scary vulnerable positions?
you simply have to try it to believe it. the
trepidation you face in doing this will test
your fearlessness, and force transformation when
you are brought to your knees by it. when you
become fearless, more love enters your life.

i think this forum suffers from over seriousness
and is inflicted with inhibition. i put myself
in goofy places as a model of possibility. to
show what is possible, in hopes that people will
open up and share, connect and add meaning to
their otherwise very boring lives.

it is a source of fullfillment to connect with
others. as a wanderer who is largely a shy loner
with few friends, this connection has happened
to me on occasion, it was beautiful and i feel
enriched by it.

but is this the right place for friendship?
largely, this is information exchange dealing
with learning facts and understanding concepts.
what place do feelings of connection and
friendship have here?

well over the last nine months, i've found my
body feeds back these feelings. i know when i've
cracked a good joke because i feel the giggles
long after mine are gone. i know when i've
popped an insepid curse because i feel the
cold chills long after i've posted. are they
associated? i have too much experience to say
this is random coincidence. is there any
science to study here? how do you study the
science of feelings? i know when my post has
been put on hold, because i feel an absence of
feelings, then after the delay and my post finally
makes it to the group, i get my feedback,
i feel the giggles or the chills or even possibly
some delightful bliss.

all this dietary regime that we go through is
to help us feel our feelings, to get in touch
with our body. all the overeating and overdrinking
and over tving numbs the body. when you've
dropped all the numbs, then you begin to feel.

when you begin to feel, then you can begin to
describe your feelings and possibly articulate
them. our culture puts little value on feelings.
most men drown their feelings with football and
potatoe chips.

this forum is another example. what value are
feelings here? are they an expression of our
spirituality? is there any accomodation for
feelings here? i would say not much. that as long
as people keep up their invulnerability armor
on and don't show who they really are, that the
feelings are going to remain inhibited and
the potential for an incredible interconnection
between us is stiffled.

what good is interconnection? i would say it
allows communication between us on a higher plane,
potential for greater fullfilment and increased
harmony within your life.

trade-offs, the choice is yours.
i've made my choice.
i've chosen to value feelings, to acknowledge
them as a means of higher level communication,
and i have been enriched by them.

okay jeremy, is this enough boring ranting?
if you are bored, bring down your barriers,
share how evil i am about attacking you and
breaking our synergy and ruining our chance
of connecting, then let's truly experience
interconnection. you know, like oil and water.

snoring,
pat


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jgernat@...
03-23-2002, 11:07 PM
<font face="arial,helvetica"><font size="2">pat,



</font><font color="#8080ff" size="2" family="sansserif" face="arial" lang="0">when you

become fearless, more love enters your life.



</font><font color="#000000" size="2" family="sansserif" face="arial" lang="0">when you relinquish the power of fear over you and your life, love replaces it.

anyone can "act" fearless. that is the mask. releasing the power of fear is a
process. letting go, surrendering, of belief systems that produce fear and replacing

with the source, love.



</font><font color="#8080ff" size="2" family="sansserif" face="arial" lang="0">

i stretch my vulnerability to explore the limits

of my freedom. i am a lover of truth and freedom.

barriers to me create separation. separation
is an illusion, if you truly embrace the law of one.

so, open sharing of honest feelings for me are

a harmonious expression of the law of one.



</font><font color="#000000" size="2" family="sansserif" face="arial" lang="0">the words are everything! should there be a limit to freedom? barriers are created

by fear, creating separation. separation is tangible in a belief system based on fear.

change the belief system and change your mind. this is transformation. this is ascension. replacing fear with the source, which is love.



sending love where there is fear.









</font><font color="#800080" size="4" family="sansserif" face="arial" lang="0">jane gernat</font><font color="#000000" size="2" family="sansserif" face="arial" lang="0">
</font><font color="#8080ff" size="2" family="sansserif" face="arial" lang="0">jgernat@aol.com

life is a circle (http://hometown.aol.com/jgernat/myhomepage/faith.html)</font><font color="#8080ff" size="2" family="sansserif" face="arial" lang="0"> </font>

Jeremy Weiland
03-25-2002, 09:01 AM
hey pat,

> personaly, i stretch these barriers to the max,
> and as jeremy pointed out, to such an extreme
> level of open honesty that it is uncomfortable.
> maybe this violates needs for emotional security.

i don't see it as a violation; in fact, my comment was
not meant as a critique or complaint. i was simply
communicating my response at an emotional level, and
trying to understand it. just because somebody
doesn't take responsibility for their feelings (by
blocking themselves off from them) doesn't mean that
you have to take responsibility for them. :-)

> barriers to me create separation. separation
> is an illusion, if you truly embrace the law of one.
> so, open sharing of honest feelings for me are
> a harmonious expression of the law of one.

i believe this a very enlightened concept of
communication, and in fact it is congruent with the
view of ra about open communication.

> what happens when you stretch yourself, put
> yourself in scary vulnerable positions?
> you simply have to try it to believe it. the
> trepidation you face in doing this will test
> your fearlessness, and force transformation when
> you are brought to your knees by it. when you
> become fearless, more love enters your life.

yes, and when one makes the realization that one has
been doing this to oneself *the whole time*, you
understand the reason for all the positions you've
"been put in", and can see that the transformation is
the end, and that life is the means.

> i think this forum suffers from over seriousness
> and is inflicted with inhibition. i put myself
> in goofy places as a model of possibility. to
> show what is possible, in hopes that people will
> open up and share, connect and add meaning to
> their otherwise very boring lives.

i think that you're judging the forum by *your*
criteria, your standards, your values, and your needs.
which is cool, and completely valid. but maybe it is
meeting the needs and standards of others. maybe for
some, it is not inhibited and overserious. or maybe
the forum is not the place where they choose to be
uninhibited and playful.

and maybe, just maybe, not all of our lives are
boring.

> it is a source of fullfillment to connect with
> others. as a wanderer who is largely a shy loner
> with few friends, this connection has happened
> to me on occasion, it was beautiful and i feel
> enriched by it.

i, too, have had moments of connection like this, but
they have never been forced - they have happened
spontaneously.

> but is this the right place for friendship?

i guess it depends on your definition of friendship.

> largely, this is information exchange dealing
> with learning facts and understanding concepts.
> what place do feelings of connection and
> friendship have here?

i think they have as much place here as in any other
place. of course, balance is neccessary. but these
facts, these concepts *mean* something to us; the
discussion of these ideas foster the feelings of
connection and friendship for many of us here, i
believe.

> all this dietary regime that we go through is
> to help us feel our feelings, to get in touch
> with our body. all the overeating and overdrinking
> and over tving numbs the body. when you've
> dropped all the numbs, then you begin to feel.

agreed.

> when you begin to feel, then you can begin to
> describe your feelings and possibly articulate
> them. our culture puts little value on feelings.
> most men drown their feelings with football and
> potatoe chips.
>
> this forum is another example.

do you really feel that way? then why are you here???

i think if you really felt this forum was as
inhibiting and numbing as football, you would not
participate.

just because people have a different approach from you
doesn't mean that their approach is wrong. maybe you
feel that your approach has been rejected, but i don't
remember ever asking you not to post.

> what value are
> feelings here? are they an expression of our
> spirituality? is there any accomodation for
> feelings here? i would say not much. that as long
> as people keep up their invulnerability armor
> on and don't show who they really are, that the
> feelings are going to remain inhibited and
> the potential for an incredible interconnection
> between us is stiffled.

but this interconnection must be desired by both
parties. otherwise, it's an infringement to demand of
somebody something they are not interested in sharing.

i agree with you that vulnerability is a way to attain
a level of honest, direct communication that allows
the self to be honest with the otherself and,
consequently, with the self. but there is no forcing
the honest communication... the moment of honesty must
be, or it can't be genuine.

there is a balance to be struck. have you considered
that maybe your quest for full, uninhibited
communication and interconnection is unbalanced? that
there is a serious element to this study of the
metaphysical that maybe you are not integrating?

> trade-offs, the choice is yours.

must there be a trade off (see my comment above)?

> i've made my choice.
> i've chosen to value feelings, to acknowledge
> them as a means of higher level communication,
> and i have been enriched by them.

hopefully, not to the exclusion of other equally
important aspects of the personality.

> okay jeremy, is this enough boring ranting?
> if you are bored, bring down your barriers,
> share how evil i am about attacking you and
> breaking our synergy and ruining our chance
> of connecting, then let's truly experience
> interconnection. you know, like oil and water.

i'm not bored, nor do i consider you evil. in fact i
think this is one of the most thoughtful posts that
has come around in a while. i appreciate the truth
that you have offered. i know it comes from a part of
you that very badly wants that interconnection. i
hope you can find it, on the list or off.

jeremy

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Sunny One
03-25-2002, 09:41 AM
thank you jeremy,
when you reply and don't withdraw,
i feel fullfilled because i need interconnection.

there was a passage that talked about feed back.
this is a sensory phenomena that transcends
any email. i have found this feedback correlates
with my emails, sometimes.
what is this phenomena? i argue that some of
us are interconnected in unconventional ways.

i liked your comment below. emotional slavery is
feeling like you are responsible for the feelings
of others. emotional liberation involves taking
responsibility for your own feelings and being
compassionate about the needs and feelings of
others.

gratefully,
pat
--- jeremy weiland <greenlantern113@... (/group/asc2k/post?postid=ggthrjo4wyluqpkvaq-d9bw9m9eph-soexky-qehklfrq-aqp3ycaxusuq7xgmh3gfh8kb2n_-0y4n5pdaij)> wrote:
>
> just because somebody
> doesn't take responsibility for their feelings (by
> blocking themselves off from them) doesn't mean that
> you have to take responsibility for them. :-)
>


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Sunny One
03-25-2002, 09:50 AM
thank you jane,
you see right through my words,
to my feelings of heatbreak.
i appreciate your spirit which
always seems to draw my tears.
pat
--- jgernat@... (/group/asc2k/post?postid=ia9ypdwiupzrp5dl2ktgfjmmvidltybjvbn77m ioctdlwy18qpfe_e9qlufj4qbor8cmnimab0ggrw) wrote:
>
> sending love where there is fear.
>
> jane gernat




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