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Jivatman
04-02-2007, 08:19 AM
"...In other words, bees may be able to perceive the unobserved quantum fields of zero-point energy, the much-debated property from which all of the phenomenal world may emerge in the eternal quantum moment."

http://www.synchronizm.com/blog/

alchemikey
04-15-2007, 11:20 AM
first i would like to start out by saying how much i love the bees...i love sitting outside when the sun is shining and watching the bees play among the flowers...before all the bees started disappearing i think they were trying to give me a message for they started to land on me quite frequently and would often hover right in front of my heart, which i must admit was kinda scary

i am not one to spread messages of fear but this whole disappearing of the honey bees does not settle well with me...life without bees is like life without water...there are a lot of ideas floating around the net about what is behind all of this, how can i help? anyone have any ideas?

“If the bee disappeared off the surface of the globe then man would only have four years of life left. No more bees, no more pollination, no more plants, no more animals, no more man.” Albert Einstein

http://news.independent.co.uk/environment/wildlife/article2449968.ece
http://www.goldenmean.info/goldenglobe/
http://www.earthfiles.com/news/news.cfm?ID=1223

peace,
mikey

LightEye
04-15-2007, 11:51 AM
Given the fact that mobile telephones use radio waves to communicate and that the atmosphere has been filled with rw's for some time now I hardly find it natural that the honey bees would have "suddenly" disappeared because of cell phones. I would look more at GM crops - re-member that animals such as those in the tsunami of 2004 weren't affected.

The question is this...

What's this telling us?

Be Well, Be Love.

David

Jivatman
04-15-2007, 11:54 AM
It may have to do with sunspots and quantum fields
http://www.synchronizm.com/blog/

alchemikey
04-15-2007, 02:02 PM
yeah i remember all the animals left for higher ground before the tsunami arrived...i don't know if it is just the honey bees raised by beekeepers that are disappearing or just honey bees in general because i still see the normal amount of "wild" bees around here when there are not cloudy skies in ny whenever that is :)

well if this is about gm crops, it seems they are trying to tell us to return to organic farming methods or disappear along with them...i did some more digging and found this which at least has a positive outlook on the situation

http://www.ascendpress.org/Community/Plants&Trees/FloweringPlantsBees.htm

peace,
mikey

Robert Riedel
04-16-2007, 12:56 AM
For a scientific exploration: http://rense.com/ , scroll down to the Morgellons box- My personal feelings are that some paronoid nut, afraid of, or responsible for the "killer bees" mania is mixing something in the chemtrails, or, as mentioned above, Moninsaneto is trying to genitically engineer every thing out of existence, starting with the insects, because they can't shoot back...

Bob

Nina
04-16-2007, 01:38 AM
Dear Mikey,
May want to see "BEES" by Rudolf Steiner. Was reading it but too much competition for my attention at present.
Fr Bk cover:"From physical depictions of the daily activities of bees to the loftiest esoteric insights, the lectures describe the unconscious wisdom contained in the beehive and its connection to our experience of health, culture and the cosmos. They are essential reading for anyone interested in understanding the ture nature of the honeybee, as well as those who wish to heal the contemporary crisis of the beehive." NINA

charran
04-16-2007, 08:28 AM
Hi All,

I think the bee issue is very much related to GM crops being planted in the US. I attended a major NE flower show in March and a Maple Festival a few weeks later. In both instances the Canadian bee keepers selling their products at the flower show and the festival told me that they have not seen their hives decimated like we have here in the US. In fact, they are thriving up there. The whole thing smells suspiciouly like GM crop plantings here in the US. I would also interject that we aren't seeing them die as much as we are seeing them not repopulate/lay eggs/grow larvae. This could explain why we don't find dead carcasses around en mass. Time to support organic more don't you think?

I would also like to note that the Maple Sugar industry in the US is also failing (supposedly due to global warming with temperatures not dipping low enough for long enough for the trees to produce lots of sweet sap). I remember reading an article a few weeks ago in the NY Times that stated that the US used to be the #1 producer of maple sugars/syrups but now production in Canada surpasses that of the US (which has declined very drastically).

Also I wonder if there isn't indeed some astrological connection between the hexagonal pattern on Saturn showing up in recent weeks, the bee (which makes honeycomb in a hexagonal pattern), and the maple trees (note that the maple leaf has a 3-lobed leaf and shape of 1/2 a hexagon).

Food for thought.

Charran

fiz
04-17-2007, 01:57 PM
Existentially I'm trying to place myself in relation to current events right now, particularly vis-a-vis recent reports (http://www.dailyitem.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070209/NEWS/702090318) on colony collapse disorder, as well as in relation to the New Scientist's recent report (http://environment.newscientist.com/channel/earth/mg19425983.700) about a looming wheat "super blight".

Taken together, these two eruptions in the biosphere could pose imminent hardship on humankind at the level of food scarcity, touching us right at the root chakra center of survival.

At present, however, we are in the position of having to "wait and see," lagooned as we are in this moment in necessary uncertainty before whatever emerging possibilities might happen to be.

Myself, I find these reports deeply unsettling. I don't want to imagine negative consequences, and I certainly don't want to magnify fear in my own life and thinking.

So I don't. I let my wonder open up and breathe through all the bad news in the world, as I contemplate the wider context of our common planetary predicament at this point in time.

I remember that we are already in the midst of planetary transformation, and that with this unknown, all other unknowns emerge against a backdrop of sweeping uncertainty and living complexity in which we cannot know the outcome of events beforehand, not only because we are still in 3D and time therefore remains relative, but also because everything is increasingly connected to everything else, and with every possibility for break down comes an equal possibility for break through.

So: I am thinking now in relation to the reports of colony collapse disorder and wheat super-blight in terms of these being nothing less than global catalysts for an increasingly connected human consciousness.

And I am asking the following questions:

If the bees remain scarce and pollen-based crops don't produce as they should, and if wheat fails to produce as it should, how will humanity respond? Will we ask for help, both from ourselves, and, possibly, from our spiritual and ET friends? What unheard of possibilities for our positive global transformation could emerge from humanity's food supply being put at chronic risk?

On the other hand, I also wonder how these possibilities could play in to the schemes of less-than humanitarian negative interests.....

I wonder, deep down, if things are accelerating before our eyes with unheard of consequences on both sides of the coin.

This moment, of course, remains a moment of uncertainty. Uncertainty is a fragile place to hang out in. It is easily filled with fear.

But, as David continues to point out in his blog, given our innate participation in the outcome of future events, how can we use our consciousness of current events -- including the emerging food crises -- to magnify openings for positive outcomes in unheard of ways?

Even if we were to find ourselves moving into a time of massive starvation, might this itself be a means for humanity to learn of its one-ness at a root-chakra level? If so, how?

I hesitate to ask these kinds of unsettling questions. Yet, it seems that folks here might be some of the most open-minded and positively-oriented people with whom to engage just this level of difficult discussion.

Chris

charran
04-18-2007, 06:18 AM
Mikey,

You might find it interesting to know that cell phone towers are "planted" in a ...get this...honeycomb "hive" pattern...each one about 6 miles away from the next.

See http://www.privateline.com/mt_digitalbasics/iv_basic_wireless_principles/01_cellular_defined/

Charran

charran
04-24-2007, 06:59 AM
Here's the latest from the Ny Times today on the bees.

"Bees Vanish and Scientists Race for Reasons"

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/24/science/24bees.html?ex=1178078400&en=36310f9dd8ddfffa&ei=5070&emc=eta1

Excerpt: More than a quarter of the country’s 2.4 million bee colonies have been lost — tens of billions of bees, according to an estimate from the Apiary Inspectors of America, a national group that tracks beekeeping. So far, no one can say what is causing the bees to become disoriented and fail to return to their hives.

As with any great mystery, a number of theories have been posed, and many seem to researchers to be more science fiction than science. People have blamed genetically modified crops, cellular phone towers and high-voltage transmission lines for the disappearances. Or was it a secret plot by Russia or Osama bin Laden to bring down American agriculture? Or, as some blogs have asserted, the rapture of the bees, in which God recalled them to heaven? Researchers have heard it all.

Charran

jax
04-25-2007, 03:26 AM
:( My brother in law who lives in Kansas called just last week and told my husband that the farmers in Kansas are really worried about the lack of bees to pollinate the crops this summer. This is important as to whether we will have food to eat or not. Not a laughing matter in the least. I feel the so many electronic gadgets that we use today are affecting the ley lines that the bees use to know how to find their way around.

Researchers have proven that sonar affects whales and causes them to beach themselves. They can't find their way around with the sonar on the ships making so much racket underwater. This happened in Puget Sound recently according to a program on PBS called Wild Kingdom. The researchers that were studying the Killer Whales in the Sound noticed the whales were acting like they were going to beach themselves so they quickly informed the Navy so that the Naval ships stopped using sonar in Puget Sound where the Orcas live.

Heather King
04-25-2007, 09:09 AM
If the moderator will tolerate one more link, I'd like to share this one...

Http://www.newmediaexplorer.org/sepp/2007/03/06

I am very interested in this subject because I live in a farming community that relies heavily on honeybees. I have indeed noticed a dearth of the little guys even on my property which isn't large, but the usual clouds of them in my plum & pear trees just didn't materialize this spring. I'm thinking the fruit crop in my backyard will be thin at best. I've been trying to include them in my meditations if for no other reason than to let them know that in my own space at least, they are missed and are always welcome. I've never understood the seemingly irrational fear people have of them...so industrious and focused, gentle little souls. I miss them.

I know nothing at all about the science behind the GWEN network, although I'm inclined to believe that as vibrationally aware as we are ALL becoming, it would stand to reason that if the scenario is real, our Bee Buddies would be feeling it long before we would.

Blessings on the Bees...and on us all.

Love,
Heather

fiz
04-25-2007, 10:15 AM
I hesitate to offer what amounts to my own fuzzy subjective guesswork, but I can't help but wonder about the possible synchronicity between "colony collapse disorder" and the recent Cassini images from Saturn showing the hexagon on its north pole, and an eerie human-like eye on the south pole.

Ra mentions how the Galactic Counsel inhabits the rings of Saturn. As with crop circles, are we perhaps being given a visual communication by ET beings? Specifically, might Saturn's hexagon and eye formations correspond to the emerging bee crisis, offering a cosmic clue as to our planetary predicament at this point in time?

Like those old mystery bottlecaps we used to decipher when I was a kid, maybe Saturn's dual-signs are suggesting that it will require a severe food crisis (the hexagon) for humanity to wake up and see (the eye formation) beyond our current blindness, and begin to read the cosmos for greater signs as to where we are and where we're headed (Ascension).

Just wondering out loud....

Chris

alchemikey
04-25-2007, 07:45 PM
perhaps the circle makers were foreshadowing the bees leaving the hive with this crop circle in 2004

http://www.greatdreams.com/crop/bee/beecc.jpg

peace,
mikey

fiz
04-25-2007, 09:17 PM
BTW, here's a link (http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.cfm?release=2006-137) showing images of Saturn's north and south poles.

Nice to see David's latest blog post linking honeybees and ET's :)

It's probably obvious, but on edit, I would just add that the hexagon on the north pole, for me, suggests the honeycomb structure of a bee hive -- hence the connection.

Peace. (On Earth.)

Chris

Robert Riedel
04-26-2007, 04:45 AM
Hey group,

I have just a tidty-bit of info to throw out on this: That famous old, Heyoka-half-breed Red Elk has been storing -up honey in five-gallon buckets for some time now. Them Indians always did know better; it's just a damn shame that we never listened to them. Perhaps it is about time to start?

Bob:mad:

pyramidnj
05-03-2007, 06:35 AM
Good Morning All! [well, in my corner of the Universe it is the good old A.M.]

Folks are beginning to see more and more the extent of the bee crisis and how there is a domino effect. Maybe they will soon begin to understand the domino effect regarding what is going on in our Universe, if the information is allowed to be passed on. Have a great one! Jo Anne

Interesting article here:

http://www.cnn.com/2007/TECH/science/05/03/honeybees.dying.ap/index.html?eref=rss_topstories
Mysterious honeybee killer could make dinner bland
POSTED: 4:50 a.m. EDT, May 3, 2007
Story Highlights
• USDA official: "This is the biggest general threat to our food supply"
• One-quarter of U.S. colonies vanish, about five times the normal winter loss
• Honeybees pollinate more than 90 of the tastiest flowering crops in U.S.
• Not all scientists foresee a food crisis, noting prior large-scale bee die-offs

BELTSVILLE, Maryland (AP) -- Unless someone or something stops it soon, the mysterious killer that is wiping out many of America's honeybees could have a devastating effect on the country's dinner plate, perhaps even reducing its people to a glorified bread-and-water diet.

Honeybees do not just make honey; they pollinate more than 90 of the tastiest flowering crops the country has.

Among them: apples, nuts, avocados, soybeans, asparagus, broccoli, celery, squash and cucumbers. And lots of the really sweet and tart stuff, too, including citrus fruit, peaches, kiwi, cherries, blueberries, cranberries, strawberries, cantaloupe and other melons.

In fact, about one-third of the human diet comes from insect-pollinated plants, and the honeybee is responsible for 80 percent of that pollination, according to the U.S. Department of Agriculture.

[more at link]

soup
05-04-2007, 08:47 PM
This thread reminds me of the Futurama episode where Leila is fretting
about Fry's death, eating honey as a sedative and Fry keeps appearing
to her telling her to wake up. Somehow the honey had traces of Fry's
DNA and he incarnates as a honey being. Eventually Leila wakes up from
being in a week long coma and it appears it was Fry was trying to save
Leila as she was dreaming in her coma of saving Fry...anybody see it?

soup
05-06-2007, 12:29 AM
I buy honey at the local farmers market.
There seem many types available, some
varieties apparently help with seasonal
allergies. Personally, I like the taste of
the orange blossom honey. I was told
that the beekeepers move the hives in
trucks in a mobil fashion. I wonder how
natural it is for a hive to be moving in
the back of a truck? The sun seems
brighter these days - is it me or is now
painful to look at some days to a greater
extent than before? Maybe the bees are
being affected by stronger Ultra Violet.

Mozart
05-07-2007, 01:00 PM
...so far is that this condition is happening through a number of factors, some of which are:



1) Hyper breeding--far too many factory-farm-focused bees have bred in unbalanced ways, so diseases have been showing up in the last few years, culminating in the latest phenom amongst the bees--the CCD. Like many other over-bred animals (dogs, farm animals, etc)the bees' genetic diversity has greatly diminished, thus adversely affecting the maintenance of the now-compromised immune systems in the colonies of the commercial, factory-farm-focused bees, as well as individual bees.


Another problem with the hyper-breeding is that the commercial bees are averaging 50% larger in size/weight compared to the natural, organic bees (that are still thriving for the most part in many areas world-wide), so the bigger, heavier commercial bees cannot stay on many flowers to get the pollen. Too big, too heavy. It seems that nature knew what she was doing.


2) Toxin overload--the factory-farm-focused bees are dealing with an overload of too many toxins from too many areas, primarily in the factory farms, where the bees' hives are sprayed heavily to ward off the mite/virus problems (which, in turn, are caused by the decreases of the commercial bees' devitalization of the immune system of the colonies and the individual bees). Organic bees are just fine in many areas.


3)GM (Genetic Modification)--Genetic Modification probably is playing a key role in the CCD. Now that the vital species barrier has been crossed in numerous farm-related species, some insects (butterflies, bees) have already shown to be highly sensitive to the effects of more-dangerous, GM-modified virus/bacterial colonies to rapidly establish themselves in the bodies of the insects. The insects would likely have yet to establish effective defenses to the GM-inspired onslaught, so there can easily be large losses of insect population before the neccessary adaptational responses in terms of harmonized genetics that strengthen the future generations of the affected insects.


4) Electromagnetic smog--it appears that bees are adverse to the cell-phone microwaves and other electromagnetic effects of modern-day devices, so they appear to be gravitating towards areas that have less electromagnetic smog and those areas tend to be rural areas that are away from cities/suburbs of electro-smoggy areas in the world.


5) Stress--factory-farm bees are frequently trucked many miles to distant farms, so the bees are not only seriously stressed from suddenly being in wholly-new locations, the bees have the stress of the trip itself, being shipped for hundreds of miles in the trailers of the big-rig semi-trucks on the highways. It is already proven that stress reduces the immune systems in many life forms, bees included.



In summation, it appears that the organic bees world-wide are ok. This may be a blessing in the sense that commercial, corporate agriculture's karma of being so brutal to nature is about to bite the corporations in their arses, big-time with possible collapses in farm production in a number of different crops in the next few years. Karma for big pharma.


Big pharmas' crop woes may trigger an additional boost to the organic food movement that is already the most-rapidly-growing "movement" in the world and would be given the added resources with which to grow more food to offset the likely losses in the factory-farm sectors of our economy. There's an aspect of the natural adaptation that DW talked about in one of his blogs.


~Seth

inside-up
05-08-2007, 06:02 PM
charran,

That NY Times article is absurd in the 2nd paragraph. Notice how they discredit some very credible possibilities by lumping them together with some absurd explainations that they allegedly found on some blogs. Were they really looking for possible answers or just trying to find the most ridiculous explainations out there (such as the rapture)?

Genetically modified crops, cellular phone towers and high-voltage transmission may or may not be the genuine reason(s) behind this, but they don't even appear worth looking into according to this Times piece. Yet credible scientific studies suggest that these 3 possibilities have some detrimental effects on living biological systems.

As for the possible contribution of chemtrails that someone mentioned. I have noticed very few chemtrails over the past 3 weeks or so. This includes a trip to North Carolina for a week and 2 weeks in New Jersey. Before this I would see them at least 4 times/week. Over the past few weeks I have seen them only 2 or 3 times total. That's at least a 75% reduction here on the east coast. Has anyone else noticed this?

jax
05-08-2007, 09:44 PM
Hi folks:

Here's DW's quote concerning the plight of the honey bees from his blog Personal Update 5/7:
"This is just one of the tasks ahead for the week. Richard Hoagland called me yesterday with a true breakthrough discovery in terms of understanding 'colony collapse disorder' with the honeybees.

Over the course of a two-hour conversation we put the whole thing together — and it's all related to 'the new physics.' Furthermore, we have a SOLUTION that can be spread to the beekeepers — something easy, cheap and probably unheard of before now — and whether you want to attribute it to 'the physics' or not, the proof is already apparent that it will work. This can help smooth our transition through the remaining years as we head into 2012. "

What solution and how fast can we get it out to the beekeepers??

I read somplace that changing the shape of bee hives to square from round is one thing that is destroying the bees. (This is sacred geometry, no?) Let's give the bees back their round bee hives!

Also Dr. Mercola (I subscribe to his health newsletter) gives a lot of information on how cell phones are bad for the health of the bees and for us as well. Pesticides are still a big factor too.
See Dr. Mercola's website at: http://v.mercola.com/blogs/public_blog/Cell-Phones-May-Be-Why-Honeybees-
Are-Disappearing-10796.aspx

Keep caring! jax

Nina
05-09-2007, 07:22 AM
DW mentioned on his blog about upcoming info re-bees.
Found something about bees in connection with St. Francis.(recall Francis,Teresa, and Augustine were noted by Ra,
see session 22, http://lawofone.info/ )
Authors Allen, of "Francis of Assisi's Canticle of the Creatures", share story told by Thomas Celano about Francis's time on a mountain where he performed penance for 40 days. No one else used the cell that was constructed for his use. It seems that an earthen vessel from which he used to drink was found there and in the vessel, they found bees! It was felt that surely this signified the sweetness of the contemplation the saint had experienced there. NINA

Mozart
05-09-2007, 09:25 AM
Hi folks:

Here's DW's quote

Over the course of a two-hour conversation we put the whole thing together — and it's all related to 'the new physics.' Furthermore, we have a SOLUTION that can be spread to the beekeepers — something easy, cheap and probably unheard of before now — and whether you want to attribute it to 'the physics' or not, the proof is already apparent that it will work.


Like you, I'm greatly looking forward to this "SOLUTION" to this bee problem. I'm guessing that it would involve sound therapy, specifically in the 439hz range or in the basic C-note range of sounds to help the bees heal and build their immune systems.


Keep in mind that the other flower-loving insects have stepped up their cross-pollination efforts, now that there's more flower nectar for them to gather, so this is one small, natural adaptational effect in play.


~Seth

jax
05-09-2007, 09:00 PM
...jax hums in the key of C- as she gardens....hummm :D

soup
05-09-2007, 09:35 PM
I just saw Dr. Laurie Moore speak about talking with animals in an intuitive way. She mentioned cell phone technology was disturbing the bees.

In listening to her I had images and impressions enter my mind - the old idea that the body is a vessel and the idea of a higher self animating a body - a sense that a human's higher self can be in intimate connection with an animals higher self and by that way communication can transpire.

If animals can sense a disturbance from cell phone technology, in the sense of their being guided by a inter dimensional higher self, than couldn't humans also? For example, could David channel as effectively near a cell phone tower as he could as far removed from one?

daernoth
05-09-2007, 10:57 PM
I think you guys should see this article i found in jeff rense's website...

http://www.redicecreations.com/article.php?id=974

Seems beekeepers that dont give antibiotics or pesticides to their bees have been unnaffected.

javier

Larry Seyer
05-11-2007, 09:45 PM
Found this today... Thought I would share:



I'm on an organic beekeeping list of about 1,000 people, mostly Americans, and no one in the organic beekeeping world, including commercial beekeepers, is reporting colony collapse on this list. The problem with the big commercial guys is that they put pesticides in their hives to fumigate for varroa mites, and they feed antibiotics to the bees. They also haul the hives by truck all over the place to make more money with pollination services, which stresses the colonies.



[url/http://www.informationliberation.com/index.php?id=21912[/url]

Enjoy!

LightEye
05-14-2007, 01:30 AM
Dear Friends,

New paper from Hoagland & DW concerning the bees disappearance.

http://www.enterprisemission.com/Bees/thebeesneeds.htm

Be Well, Be Love.

David

The Bees' Needs:
It's the Physics, Stupid!
By Richard C. Hoagland and David Wilcock
(C) 2007 The Enterprise Mission

INTRODUCTION: NEW SCIENCE REVEALS THE SOLUTION

The epic, unprecedented, literal disappearance of the world's honeybee population -- termed officially "Colony Collapse Disorder" (CCD), that suddenly began to be reported only last November -- is extraordinarily serious. However, contrary to some of the most severe of these mainstream reports, it does not have to spell "the end of life as we know it on Earth."

There is an elegant, inexpensive solution to the crisis -- almost absurdly simple at the face of it -- for both identifying, and then fixing, the underlying problem. Mainstream scientists cannot explain why this method would work, in fact, by their own admission they still don't even know the source of CCD ... let alone, that a ready solution also currently exists. Therefore, most would automatically assume our proposal to be either a fluke, or outright fantasy.

It is neither.

The answers to the crucial questions now being asked by increasingly desperate beekeepers, baffled scientists and millions of concerned "ordinary folks," as "X-Files-type reports" of the literal, escalating, world-wide disappearance of billions of domestic honeybees continue to pour in, is to be found in a long-suppressed "new" branch of science -- which both authors of this Report have been researching and developing ... if not openly discussing ... for many years.

Our civilization has developed marvelous gadgets, giving us instantaneous, worldwide data and audio-visual communcation. The signals travel through "empty space" on invisible electromagnetic waves -- for which, the existence of civilization (if not our own existence!) now depends. Nature and the biology of the "natural world" is no different -- but instead of electromagnetic waves, it uses (in part) something called "torsion fields" for the same essential purpose -- to transmit vital signals into and between living eco-systems, so that they may function properly.

Globally, literally thousands of "peer reviewed" scientific papers on these "torsion fields" have been written in the last half century or so, yet wide-spread scientific knowledge of this critical, fundamental aspect of physics and biology has been almost completely excluded from the world of academic scientists and mainstream research institutions -- to say nothing of the popular scientific press -- in the so-called "Western world." There is a crucial, calculated reason for this ignorance, which we shall get to.

However, as we shall demonstate in this Report, Nature doesn't care whether Western science has heard about (or "peer reviewed" ...) these fields or not -- it just uses them, to overwhelmingly significant effect.

Later in this work, the authors will also prove -- including, with reference to results from their own "torsion field experiments" -- precisely how this "Hyperdimensional Physics" can now be used to truly answer ... and then solve ... the greatest short-term environmental crisis of our time--

"What's happening to the domestic bees!?"

wicherink
05-14-2007, 02:52 PM
David’s latest blog titled ‘It’s the physics stupid’ promises to become an interesting article. He’s explaining the Colony Collapse Disorder (CCD) of bees occurring globally now as a phenomenon related to the changing fabric of the physical vacuum and the torsion fields contained therein. The torsion fields within our solar system and probably beyond are changing and may cause for a disorientation of the bees since they seem to be navigating on these torsion fields.

http://www.enterprisemission.com/Bees/thebeesneeds.htm

The article will probably focus in on the works of Dr. Victor Grebennikov that has been discussed in David’s work before:

http://www.divinecosmos.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=103&Itemid=36

Since the changing torsion fields within our solar system interfere with the natural torsion fields radiated by the honeycombs of the bees themselves, the bees may get disorientated.

David points out that although the electromagnetic waves of cell phones and the like may interfere with the natural occurring torsion fields on our planet, they are unlikely to explain why the CCD is occurring so suddenly on a global basis since the electro smog has been around for quit a number of years now.

I would like David to have a look at this article:
http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/realityzone/UFNbeekeepers.htm

The article states that the CCD does NOT occur in bee colonies that are organically kept. Somehow the CCD problem seems to be related to the pesticides and antibiotics used in the hives to kill the varroa mites, so the author of this article claims.

CCD has also already been linked to Monsanto’s herbicide ‘Roundup’. The accumulation of more and more herbicides is putting a biological pressure on the biosphere and may be affecting the bees as well.
Quote:
“AND THE HONEY BEES. WITH THE CREATION OF THESE FRANKENSTEIN CROPS AND FRANKENSTEIN WEEDS, ISN’T EMERGING A MAJOR QUESTION ABOUT ACCUMULATION? NO ONE REALLY KNOWS THE ANSWER TO HOW MUCH IS TOO MUCH FOR EARTH LIFE? AND THAT THE PILING ON OF HERBICIDES NOW AGAINST RESISTANT WEEDS, MADE RESISTANT THROUGH THE APPLICATION OF GENETICALLY MODIFIED HERBICIDES, YOU ARE INCREASING PESTICIDES OUT THERE IN THE WORLD WITH UNKNOWN CONSEQUENCES?”

http://www.earthfiles.com/news/news.cfm?ID=1223

There may be a multitude of factors involved in explaining CCD?

Regards
Jan

charran
05-14-2007, 08:10 PM
Jan,

A few days ago I saw the article you mentioned, http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/reali...beekeepers.htm

and would definitely second your opinion of it and request that David please read it.

It was VERY interesting to read about the average size of a cell in an organic honeycomb being 4.6mm in diameter versus the artificial honeycomb size in non-organic honey farms being 5.4. Honeycomb is like a pyramid...it must be built in the proper proportions.

Charran
----------
Excerpt from the article:

This change from fighting the mites is mostly because I've gone to natural sized cells. In case you weren't aware, and I wasn't for a long time, the foundation in common usage results in much larger bees than what you would find in a natural hive. I've measured sections of natural worker brood comb that are 4.6mm in diameter. What most people use for worker brood is foundation that is 5.4mm in diameter. If you translate that into three dimensions instead of one, it produces a bee that is about half as large again as is natural. By letting the bees build natural sized cells, I have virtually eliminated my Varroa and Tracheal mite problems. One cause of this is shorter capping times by one day, and shorter post-capping times by one day. This means less Varroa get into the cells, and less Varroa reproduce in the cells.

Nina
05-15-2007, 06:40 AM
Hi Everyone,
So many fine articles shared re-BEES. Especially liked the one that Jan shared with emphasis on "natural". Had mentioned on other thread about Steiner book "Bees"(bk cover - lectures describe the unconscious wisdom contained in the beehive and its connection with our experience of health, culture and the cosmos). Would recommend exploring, also possibly more current anthroposophical / biodynamic researchers - book is almost 10 yrs old and based on Steiner's lectures given in 1923.
Will share a quote that gives a strong sense:
"Nature has placed a truly wonderful wisdom into the entire manner in which a bee society functions. Bees respond to certain powers of nature that are extremely important ...It is still true today that whenever we intrude on these powers of nature, we tend to make things worse rather than better. But we don't worsen things immediately, since nature has limitations everywhere. Despite these constraints, nature operates in the best way it can. We can remove certain limitations and thereby make things alittle easier for nature. We have, for instance,seemingly really helped nature very much in regard to beekeeping by using, instead of the older beehives, the newer type of beehive boxes that are arranged with comfort in mind for both bee and human.
But now we come to this whole new chapter concerning the artificial breeding of bees....But the strong breeding of a bee generation, a bee family will be detrementally affected over the longer period...Certain forces that have operated organically in the beehive until now will become mechanized , will in themselves be mechanically carried out. It won't be possible to establish the intimate relationship between a queen bee you have purchased and the worker bees the way it would arise all by itself in nature. But at the beginning the effects of this are not apparent."
Steiner gives suggestions to prevent bee diseases due to an understanding of the complex mechanisms involved in bee health related to gigantic task of collecting nectar and converting to honey.
Also, he details: "...the bee collects from everything available in nature the very form of nourishment that carry over into our bodies this same hexagonally acting force, a force that produces a six-sided effect."
Steiner goes in to much detail about this six-sided hexagonal formative force that works via the honey upon humans. He says this power is inside the bee.
Steiner notes many fascinating relationships with this six-sidedness.
He touched on the significance of hexacyanoplatinate: "Only with the help of anthroposophic science will we be led to observe such things as the fact that when hexacyanoplatinate is particularly affected by light, one type of feeling is taking place there. The intensity of this type of activity is present to the greatest degree in bees."
Will give you an example of this wondrous creature that amazed me. He gave details about how when a person is calm and approaches bees, the bee "notices that the person's blood has the same amount of the six-sided power it has" and does not sting! It is different if one is angry or afraid! (related to blood/skin pale/normal/ or red!)
Can hardly wait for more of David's fine research.(Thanks Jan for bringing that article to our attention again). Sorry not a better reporter - this is very complex and do not have a science background! NINA
Can search for bees from

http://www.rsarchive.org

inside-up
05-15-2007, 10:52 AM
From what I could find (and I have not researched this exhaustively) it seems that the mechanisim(s) for CCD is not known. Why is there a reduction of the number of bees?

Reasons I have come across:
*They are dying
*They are not reproducing at the same rate as in past years
*They are getting lost

It seems there is no definitive answer to this question (only theories). Before a cause can be found or proven it seems we need to find and prove what has happened to the bees themselves. Tracking bees, it seems, is infinitely more difficult than tracking humans.

Questions that need to be answered include:

Is this a worldwide problem, or is it specific to certain areas?
Are any organic hives being affected? (aside from annecdotal statements from a few organic keepers ALL organic keepers should be polled)
Is this affecting all species of bees?
Could this have anything to do with the killer bees that were migrating and breeding with other bees and/or an attempt to get rid of them?

Bev
05-15-2007, 12:18 PM
Dear asc2k Friends:
In 1999 I read the book, "Energy Blessings from the Stars-Seven Initiations," by Virginia Essene and Irving Feurst. Besides some great reading about energies, you could request seven "shaktis" from seven different star systems that would give you blessings of Hope, Breath, Love, Compassion, Soul Awareness, Integration of Matter with Spirit, and Christ Consciousness. In my journal for the Compassion blessing, I wrote the following:

I remember seeing a honeycomb pattern, in different colors, white background with patches of color on them. There seemed to be pictograph-like shapes inside the honeycombs. I excitedly said, "I see it!" and the response was, "Not too many can see it."

It seems somehow the honeycomb shape was the interdimensional "fiber optics" used to convey the shakti from the Vega masters. Perhaps the honeycomb pattern used by the bees is somehow used to communicate the energetic connection to the bees where the nectar was collected. Food for thought? (pun intended!);)

Healing Love,
Bev

wicherink
05-15-2007, 03:50 PM
Hi Nina,

Don’t apologize for your 'poor' knowledge of science when you mentioned quote ‘Sorry not a better reporter - this is very complex and do not have a science background!’

You brought up a very strong point that I think David will be addressing in his article. You mentioned the hexagonal structure of the beehive cells, and this is a very important point as it relates to torsion wave physics.

Remember David’s article about the hexagon on Saturn, it’s all related when it comes to understanding torsion physics!!!

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.cfm?release=2007-034

I will repeat what I responded earlier with respect to this article about the hexagonal structure on Saturn as the torsion physics pertaining to the beehive is similar in nature (as above so below):

Not only could the ‘hexagon’ on Saturn represent an icosahedron, it could also represent a dodecahedron!!! (as strange as this may sound at first).

If you carefully look at the pictures of the ‘hexagon’ you may notice that at the vertices a short edge of around ¼ of the edge of the regular hexagon can be observed. It gives the impression that the hexagon has ‘rounded’ vertices.
Take a careful look at the left vertice in the bottom picture:

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.cfm?release=2007-034

Also the black and white picture on this page shows this feature clearly. So it seems there are more than 6 vertices in this ‘perfect’ hexagon.

What it could represent is the top view of a dodecahedron observed from an angle that will give it its ‘hex view’:

http://www.zayra.de/soulcom/physicsofphi/Image26.gif

Since the icosahedron and the dodecahedron are duals they can be nested into an ico-dodeca alternating fractal geometry. This geometry implodes from large to small scale and describes the geometry of a vortex as has been demonstrated by Dan Winter.

This geometry then may explain why we see ‘nested’ hexagons on Saturn which in reality are nested icosa-dodeca fractals. The fact that the nested ‘hexagons’ on Saturn do not align but are slightly rotated when you go down from one hexagon to the other, may be an indication that we’re dealing with this kind of fractal geometry.

The North Pole of Saturn shows the icosa-dodeca geometry because here the vortex implodes to a zero point while at the South Pole this geometry gets blurred because of a widening of the funnel of the vortex.

You can read more on this icosa-dodeca fractal from the work of Dan Winter here: http://www.zayra.de/soulcom/physicsofphi/PhysicsofPHI.html

And quit similarly the hexagon shape of the beehive cells harvests the torsion wave energy from the universe that is all around us.

Regards
Jan

Nina
05-16-2007, 02:05 PM
Dear Jan and Everyone,
Steiner-based Waldorf Education Resources offers two new books by John Blackwood: "Mathematics Around Us" and "Mathematics in Space and Time" for 7th and 8th graders! No "time" now to read your links, but will asap. Thanks for what you shared. NINA

Nina
05-18-2007, 01:43 PM
Dear Jan and Everyone,
Found myself drawn to some good advice:
Cayce Reading 1089-3
"Meditate, oft. Separate thyself for a season from the cares of the world. Get close to nature and LEARN from the lowliest of that which manifests in nature, in the earth, in the birds, in the trees, in the grass, in the flowers, in the bees, that the life of each is a manifesting, is a song of glory to its Maker. And do thou likewise!"
Learning so much daily about so many relationships! (Yes, Jan, thank-you, did get to links with pictures of potential meaning and the fine article "The Physics of Phi, Compression, Implosion, Gravity, Time and Love".) Please keep sharing your observations - NINA

Art
05-20-2007, 08:25 AM
I hate to say it, but thankfully the second part of DW's article on this hasn't been posted yet. If I had to venture a guess as to why the bee's are "lost" it would be the subtle changes in the torsion waves as our solar system is entering the "new energy" realm. In my earlier studies I ran across the CSE - Cavity Structural Effect mentioned in one of DW's articles.

Anyway, alot of insects and animals have a "homing sense", and I although I am not qualified to make any predictions, I would guess that as we enter further into this new energy "realm" that we will see more and more "lost" creatures. Think of the humpback whales in the river in California. I would be interested to read reports of other "unusual" events like this...

In the past, I had always believed that animals navigate via an internal geo-magnetic "compass"... Changes in the Earth's magnetic qualities (think pole shifting) could affect this "homing compass", correct? I would ask the group their opinions on "relating" the two concepts 1) geo-magnetic navigation and 2) torsion-wave CSE... Maybe one in the same?

Oh, and I apologize for the "quality" of this post - in a rush...

Art
05-20-2007, 08:29 AM
Wicherink has already written about CSE in the first post. Sorry for the reiteration!

soup
05-20-2007, 10:17 PM
I wonder if the demise of "nature's worker bee" is foreshadowing the demise of the "human worker bee". That similar effects affect different species at different rates. Fundamentally, it may be a change for the better - that by changing something there opens opportunity for something else, as if a niche closing opens another niche for something else. Maybe the bees have evolved to higher lifeforms and so have enjoyed not having to do the same old buzzing around the flowers routine that they've done tirelessly for so long...

I remember Dr. Laurie Moore talking about the beached whales, saying that people worked to move the pod to deeper whater whereupon the whales beached themselves again - an animal intuitive approached to see what was up with that and apparently they were consciously committing suicide in order that they do work elsewhere for a while. As soon as she told that story, the concept of the Indigo kids came to my mind. I thought that was curious, so I mention it in case it ressonates with someone. She also advised that it is common within animals to intuitively sense a sort of bodily detachment, to a higher degree than is typically found within humans.

Kindredspirit
05-21-2007, 11:30 AM
Hello, everyone.

There are so many topics that can be broached when you begin to talk about the honeybees: our economy, chemtrails, CDC, 2012, polar shifts,...it's enough to blow one's mind.

But back to the honeybee, which is where my passion lies right now, I created a website called: www.Saveabeeaday.blog.com. I tried to give an overview so people who knew nothing would have some clue about what was going on and those who knew a lot would get where I was coming from.

My purpose, however, is TO SAVE THE BEES. I believe they are telling us that WE CAN DO MORE THAN WE REALIZE, BUT WE HAVE TO FIRMLY BELIEVE. I think the bees are telling us lots of other things, but let's just start here.

www.Saveabeeaday.com

Thank you for allowing me to join your forum.

Dianne

DAYDREAMS@onelink.ca
05-23-2007, 10:39 PM
Hi Dianne,
I checked out the site...left you a message. The Savabeeaday idea can be applied all over the human experience map. As we learn to take responsibility for our thoughts we won't create the same kind of world. In the meantime I'm sending bees all the good vibrations...as a gardener and sojourner in gardens, I love bee company, and their buziness has my complete respect.
Namaste
Anne

leo scone
05-24-2007, 05:44 AM
One thing I wonder about with CCD and all the potential causes being spoken of is why, when cell phones and towers, and GM crops, and pesticides and all these other factors have been around for years, is there such an immediacy and broad-spread nature to the problem? While I don't have the link to offer, I did at one point see video taken by someone of large quantities of bees all twitching around and dying in a parking lot simultaneously. That doesn't sound like an attritional effect which one might expect from the build up of chemicals and the lowering of immuno responses. As well, I recall the news, from Texas, Australia, and elsewhere, of huge BIRD die offs, where whole flocks were apparently dropped at the same time. I think these things apply to some form of deadly single application of some technology, and that most likely, to affect large numbers simultaneously, would be electro-magnetic in origin. So, are they pumping NEW AND DIFFERENT frequencies through the cell towers? Or is it perhaps discrete applications of HAARP technology that takes out whole swarms and flocks at the same time? It seems to me that either this type of scenario is likely, and/or the bees are simply ahead of the curve on the vibrational changes occuring to us all planet wide and what we see as a major problem is just their appropriate adaptation to the changing nature of the vibrational structure of this reality. In any case, I invite the bees with as much love and light as I can into our organic garden, and so far here in Southern Oregon, despite ongoing chemtrails and cell tower construction, the bees seem to be doing okay.

Love, Blessings, and Abundance y'all!

soup
05-24-2007, 07:42 PM
More and more i've been reaching for my sunglasses - used to be comfortable without them for so long. Maybe i'm getting old or something, or maybe it is that my irises are getting lazy.

Then again, maybe part of this may be that the sun appears brighter. If this is the case, possibly the bee's vision is affected. The human eye has a tremendous dynamic range because of irises, but a bee eye doesn't have irises. It may not have the dynamic range toward the bright end as humans can accomodate. Possibly the multifaceted nature of a sun appearing brighter is overwhelming in some way to a bee, who isn't able to wear any sunglasses.

DAYDREAMS@onelink.ca
05-25-2007, 08:47 AM
I find myself requiring sunglasses as well...didn't wear them for years...don't like the way they change the color spectrum.

The acid test will be this fall when the crops that depend on bees ripen, or not.

Namaste
Anne

charran
06-04-2007, 09:40 AM
Catch the Buzz....new bee story

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/dorset/6691851.stm

A swarm of approximately 20,000 bees was "ingested" by a plane in the UK as it tried to fly.

They sure are flyin' high and clustering in strange places.

Charran

soup
06-04-2007, 07:46 PM
Maybe the bees are tired of serving others as bees and want to take an evolutionary jump into another lifeform with their service to others attitude,
i.e. they want to make harvest.

Old Soul
06-20-2007, 05:59 AM
Thanks for writing this information. I have felt for some time the new chemical poisons are much more harmful to all lives than most of us realize. When I walk into a Hardware or store that has these chemicals on the shelves I can actually
feel the chemicals on my skin far before reaching the shelves where they are kept. I shudder when I think of the brief instances where I have observed these chemicals being used almost with out thought and without reading the directions on the poison completely before application.
I have learned long ago that basic Law for every action there is a reaction often with very subtle consequences.
Our modern society has many,many, forms of denial as we live this "good life."
We are much like the bees in a hive until something disrupts the flow of milk and honey.
Thank you for a quiet place to express something about what is really going on far from the noise out there.
Thank You,
Old Soul

fiz
06-21-2007, 07:24 AM
HAARP Transmissions May Accidentally be Jamming Bees Homing Ability, June 1, 2007
By Guy Cramer

http://www.hyperstealth.com/haarp/index.htm

From the article:

Beginning in the Summer of 2006, bee hives in more than half the U.S. States, Four Canadian Provinces and a number of Countries in Europe have mysteriously been losing billions of bees in what is now being termed Colony Collapse Disorder, Canadian officials have yet to declare their bee losses are due to this disorder. Essentially the mature worker bees leave the hive and do not return leaving the Queen and immature workers unable to sustain the hive. Due to the recent outbreak and distances involved in the regions affected most researchers are unable to explain why this is occurring. Currently one theory suggests the electromagnetic waves may be causing interference with bees’ navigation as previous small scale research showed that 70% of the bees did not return to the hive when cordless phone transmitters placed within the colonies. Here we show that a U.S. military radio transmitter (ionospheric heater) array, the most powerful in the world, transitioned to full power in 2006 and reception of signals transmitted cover the same region as the Colony Collapse Disorder. The High-frequency Active Auroral Research Project is an antenna array located in Alaska. It a congressionally initiated program jointly managed by the U.S. Air Force and U.S. Navy. The Array has been used to conduct numerous ionospheric and radio wave propagation research studies over the past decade. One project study conducted in 1997 showed the radio transmission range was only received in North America and Europe. This Array transitioned to full power and military use just prior to the summer of 2006 with an increase in output from 9.6 kilowatts to 3.6 megawatts. The corresponding timing and range with the Colony Collapse Disorder suggests recent transmissions from the array could be the most likely cause of the bee problem.

pyramidnj
07-10-2007, 12:49 PM
I am copying below an email I received from a newsgroup to which I belong [hsiresearch] -- quite interesting!

"The mystery of the missing honeybees may have a simple solution. But will anyone pay attention?

--------------------------------------------
Antibiotic bees
--------------------------------------------

Over the past few months I've been following a stream of daily updates about colony collapse disorder (CCD), the phenomenon in which bees abandon their hives and disappear. CCD continues to be reported throughout the U.S. and Canada - a potential disaster for food crops that require pollination.

Most of the updates I've seen come from newspapers that detail local incidences of CCD. And most of them read the same: a description of the overall problem followed by interviews with local beekeepers. Each of these accounts notes the various theories about what causes CCD (all speculation at this point): fungi, bacteria, pesticides, parasitic mites, weakened immune systems, and even interference from cell phone towers.

But this week I came across an entirely different CCD article. The title: "No ORGANIC Bee Losses."

This article is described as a "widely circulated email" from Sharon Labchuk, an environmental activist and part-time beekeeper. Ms. Labchuk states that she's on an organic beekeeping list of about 1,000 beekeepers - mostly American - and "no one in the organic beekeeping world, including commercial beekeepers, is reporting colony collapse on this list.

"The problem with the big commercial guys is that they put pesticides in their hives to fumigate for varroa mites, and they feed antibiotics to the bees. They also haul the hives by truck all over the place to make more money with pollination services, which stresses the colonies."

--------------------------------------------
Forget me not
--------------------------------------------

Ms. Labchuk goes on to quote a message from a web site maintained by beekeeper Michael Bush. Mr. Bush explains that he has no problems with varroa mites because he uses natural sized cells. Larger commercial beekeepers tend to use larger hive foundations, which result in larger cells and larger bees than those in natural hives.

Mr. Bush: "By letting the bees build natural sized cells, I have virtually eliminated my Varroa and Tracheal mite problems."

Ms. Labchuk's response: "Who should be surprised that the major media reports forget to tell us that the dying bees are actually hyper-bred varieties that we coax into a larger than normal body size? It sounds just like the beef industry."

And who should be surprised that media reports also tend to gloss over any potential connection between genetically modified (GM) crops and CCD? We're told there's no evidence of such a link and the subject is dropped, as if evidence would be impossible to produce. Okay - no evidence - then how about the next best thing?

In October 2000, Joe Rowland (a beekeeper and the secretary/treasurer of the Empire State Honey Producers Association) testified before the New York Assembly regarding the way GM organisms might affect honeybees. He drew his testimony from available research and his own knowledge of honeybee biology.

After noting that pollen is the honeybee's protein source and that the gene structure of pollen is modified in GM crops, he offered this comment: "Findings indicate that none of the tested pollens kill adult bees outright, but that they may shorten their lifespan and cause some behavioral changes, particularly in a loss of their ability to learn and to smell. This may cause foraging bees to 'forget' where flowers or even their own hive is located."

Note that this comment was made a full seven years before the phrase "colony collapse disorder" was coined. Those seven years may have taken a heavy toll. "

linsybyster
07-12-2007, 11:19 PM
Indeed. My husband and I are planning to start an eco-village, at which point we'll be off-grid and quite self-sufficient. We are switching careers in light of the fact that we won't need as much money and we are also choosing training that will be useful if we need to be self-sufficient. My husband has chosen beekeeping. In researching the field (he was initally worried about CCD as well), he found the same thing. Organic operations have not been affected.

pyramidnj
07-13-2007, 04:26 AM
Lynsy: Would you please contact me via private email? I have some information that you may be able to use for your project. I tried sending a private message to you, but [as has happened to me and others before] each time I try to submit a reply the system says that I need to login, whereas I am already logged in!

Much Love and Light!
Jo Anne

LightEye
10-09-2007, 09:51 AM
Dear Friends,

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0%2C2933%2C299982%2C00.html

Be Well, Be Love.

David

Following Honeybee Disappearance, Bumblebees Begin Vanishing Act
Tuesday, October 09, 2007

GRANTS PASS, Ore. — Looking high and low, Robbin Thorp can no longer find a species of bumblebee that just five years ago was plentiful in northwestern California and southwestern Oregon.

Thorp, an emeritus professor of entomology from the University of California at Davis, found one solitary worker last year along a remote mountain trail in the Siskiyou Mountains, but hasn't been able to locate any this year.

He fears that the species — Franklin's bumblebee — has gone extinct before anyone could even propose it for the endangered species list. To make matters worse, two other bumblebee species — one on the East coast, one on the West — have gone from common to rare.

Ceara
10-09-2007, 04:33 PM
I saw only one bee this summer (2007).

I only saw one bumblebee as well, but it wasn't outside. We brought in some wood that was cut down at a neighbor's place for us to burn, and I found the little one crawling sluggishly on the floor. I felt for it, and told my husband to not kill it, so we captured it and set it outside, unsure what else could be done for it. Or maybe it was a carpenter bee. *shrug*

All I know is I've hardly seen any this summer.

AmelieJolie
10-10-2007, 03:09 AM
I live in the UK. I don't think I've seen many this year either, although I'm sure I must have seen one or two. It's a shame because they are such lovely creatures. I remember rescuing one as a little girl and I noticed it had a nice little face!

LOVE

Kris
10-10-2007, 04:39 PM
I live in Canada and have noticed the decline in the bumblebees as well. I have a plant in my garden. I'm not sure what kind it is; it looks like broccoli but changes from green to a reddish colour in September. At times, usually on warm sunny days, it has been inundated with about 30 wasps at a time. I only saw two or three bees the whole time on this plant and I think maybe only one other bee elsewhere all summer. So it would seem that they are noticeably missing all over the planet, if it's been observed in Canada, the U.S. and the U.K.

Nina
01-24-2008, 05:40 AM
[QUOTE=wicherink;21169]Hi Nina,

Don’t apologize for your 'poor' knowledge of science when you mentioned quote ‘Sorry not a better reporter - this is very complex and do not have a science background!’

Dear Jan and Everyone,
Found this link to Bobby Matherne's review of Steiner's BEES. NINA
http://www.doyletics.com/arj/beesrvw.htm

LightEye
01-28-2008, 12:48 PM
Dear Friends,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL-A8Apn1_s

Also this link. Click "the film" for more info;

http://www.vanishingbees.com/

Be Well, Be Love.

David

Zenxlow
01-28-2008, 02:54 PM
thanks for the video, I'm sharing it with my media arts class. :)

this bee-crisis is among many epidemics which we must learn from quickly, accept our responsibilities, and re-harmonize ourselves with the planet and her children

Sue
01-30-2008, 04:58 AM
The birds are disappearing, too. When I was little,
the sounds of the birds in the mornings was deafening.
You just don't hear that anymore. Due to the chemtrails
killing the insects, and the genetically engineered
foods, the birds just don't have much to eat anymore.
Humanity just doesn't have much longer. Who wants
to see the handwriting on the wall?

estopatitiana
01-31-2008, 09:50 PM
I think its great to see that we care about bees so much, its so easy to overlook the lives of the tinest critters out there, and my heart is touched by how much many here seem to care about the bees themselves as much as our food crop.
I remember i would save "pests" from my parents garden because i couldnt bare seeing them die

transiten
03-09-2008, 04:28 AM
Hive!

To bee or not to bee, that's the question!

Don't worry! Bee Happy!

Liliane

DancingHoneyBee
03-09-2008, 09:20 AM
All of us are not gone, not yet! :p

LightEye
03-25-2008, 11:36 AM
Dear Friends,

I couldn't find our thread on bee's. Here's a new article.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=8436

Be Well, Be Love.

David

Death of the Bees: GMO Crops and the Decline of Bee Colonies in North America
by Brit Amos
Global Research, March 25, 2008

‘Commercial beehives pollinate over a third of [North}America’s crops and that web of nourishment encompasses everything from fruits like peaches, apples, cherries, strawberries and more, to nuts like California almonds, 90 percent of which are helped along by the honeybees. Without this pollination, you could kiss those crops goodbye, to say nothing of the honey bees produce or the flowers they also fertilize’.1

This essay will discuss the arguments and seriousness that affects the massive deaths and the decline of Bee colonies in North America. As well, it will shed light on a worldwide hunger issue that will have an economical and ecological impact in the very near future.

There are many reasons given to the decline in Bees, but one argument that matters most is the use of Genetically Modified Organism (GMO) and Terminator seeds that are presently being endorsed by governments and forcefully utilized as our primary agricultural needs of survival. I will argue what is publicized and covered by the media is in actuality, masking the real problems of Terminator seeds and Genetically Modified Organisms (GMO’s).

Terminator seeds; genetically produced and distributed by powerful multinational lobbies manipulate government and agricultural policy to encompass their agenda of dominance in the agricultural industry. American conglomerates such as Monsanto, Pioneer Seeds, and others, have created seeds that do not reproduce (whereas these seeds have a life span of the crop chosen). The sterilizing of the plant by the means of sterilizing the flower pollen genetically altered and mutated for production in the agricultural industry. Logic states that if the flower pollen is sterile, bees are potentially going malnourished and dying of illness due to the lack of nutrients and the interruption of the of the digestive capacity of what they feed on through the summer and over the winter hibernation process.

I will argue that the media’s publications distract the civil population of the true cause of the Colony Collapse of Bees. As such, outlined are four major arguments in which the conglomerates of GMO’s and terminator seeds use to redirect public awareness concerning the truth about the demise of the bees. These arguments include Varroa mites, parasites, cell phones, and terminator seeds

Muse
03-26-2008, 01:11 PM
Hi David.

You might be interested to know that I had a huge swarm (thousands) of honey bees visit my front yard earlier this week. It was so great to see so many of them. Before I got my Negator last week, I would see one or two around the yard, and tell them that I was so HAPPY to see them.

IN other words, my inner appreciation of them opened the vortex, and I believe that I was given an EMF Negator to open up the vortex around my home even more. So yesterday I went to the Farmer's Market, and bought 3 pounds of raw, unfiltered, unstrained, unheated, wildflower honey.

The week before that I got this forward about HONEY and CINNAMON

Cinnamon & Honey

Bet the drug companies won't like this one getting around...

Facts on honey and cinnamon: It is found that a mixture of honey and cinnamon cures most diseases. Honey is produced in most of the countries of the world. Scientists of today also accept honey as a "Ram Ban" (very effective) medicine for all kinds of diseases. Honey (raw-unprocessed) can be used without any side effects for any kind of diseases.

Today's science says that even though honey is sweet, if taken in the right dosage as a medicine, it does not harm diabetic patients. Weekly World News, a magazine in Canada, in it's issue dated 17 January, 1995, has given the following list of diseases that can be cured by honey and cinnamon as researched by western scientists:

HEART DISEASES:
Make a paste of honey and cinnamon powder, apply on bread, instead of jelly and jam, and eat it regularly for breakfast. It reduces the cholesterol in the arteries and saves the patient from heart attack. Also those who have already had an attack, if they do this process daily, they are kept miles away from the next attack. Regular use of the above process relieves loss of breath and strengthens the heart beat. In America and Canada, various nursing homes have treated patients successfully and have found that as you age, the arteries and veins lose their flexibility and get clogged; honey and cinnamon revitalize the arteries and veins.

ARTHRITIS:
Arthritis patients may take daily, morning, and night, one cup of hot water with two spoons of honey and one small teaspoon of cinnamon powder. If taken regularly even chronic arthritis can be cured. In a recent research conducted at the Copenhagen University, it was found that when the doctors treated their patients with a mixture of one tablespoon Honey and half teaspoon Cinnamon powder before breakfast, they found that within a week, out of the 200 people so treated, practically 73 patients were totally relieved of pain, and within a month, mostly all the patients who could not walk or move around because of arthritis started walking without pain.

BLADDER INFECTIONS:
Take two tablespoons of cinnamon powder and one teaspoon of honey in a glass of lukewarm water and drink it. It destroys the germs in the bladder.

TOOTHACHE:
Make a paste of one teaspoon of cinnamon powder and five teaspoons of honey and apply on the aching tooth. This may be applied three times a day until the tooth stops aching.

CHOLESTEROL:
Two tablespoons of honey and three teaspoons of Cinnamon Powder mixed in 16 ounces of tea water, given to a cholesterol patient, was found to reduce the level of cholesterol in the blood by 10 percent within two hours. As mentioned for arthritic patients, if taken three times a day, any chronic cholesterol is cured. According to information received in the said journal pure honey taken with food daily relieves complaints of cholesterol.

COLDS:
Those suffering from common or severe colds should take one tablespoon lukewarm honey with 1/4 spoon cinnamon powder daily for three days. This process will cure most chronic cough, cold, and clear the sinuses.

UPSET STOMACH:
Honey taken with cinnamon powder cures stomach ache and also clears stomach ulcers from the root.

GAS:
According to the studies done in India and Japan, it is revealed that if honey is taken with cinnamon powder the stomach is relieved of gas.

IMMUNE SYSTEM:
Daily use of honey and cinnamon powder strengthens the immune system and protects the body from bacteria and viral attacks. Scientists have found that honey has various vitamins and iron in large amounts. Constant use of honey strengthens the white blood corpuscles to fight bacteria and viral diseases.

INDIGESTION:
Cinnamon powder sprinkled on two tablespoons of honey taken before food relieves acidity and digests the heaviest of meals.

INFLUENZA:
A scientist in Spain has proved that honey contains a natural Ingredient which kills the influenza germs and saves the patient from flu.

LONGEVITY:
Tea made with honey and cinnamon powder, when taken regularly, arrests the ravages of old age. Take four spoons of honey, one spoon of cinnamon powder and three cups of water and boil to make like tea. Drink 1/4 cup, three to four times a day. It keeps the skin fresh and soft and arrests old age. Life spans also increases and even a 100 year old, starts performing the chores of a 20-year-old.

PIMPLES:
Three tablespoons of honey and one teaspoon of cinnamon powder paste. Apply this paste on the pimples before sleeping and wash it next morning with warm water. If done daily for two weeks, it removes pimples from the root.

SKIN INFECTIONS:
Applying honey and cinnamon powder in equal parts on the affected parts cures eczema, ringworm and all types of skin infections.

WEIGHT LOSS:
Daily in the morning one half hour before breakfast on an empty stomach and at night before sleeping, drink honey and cinnamon powder boiled in one cup of water. If taken regularly, it reduces the weight of even the most obese person. Also, drinking this mixture regularly does not allow the fat to accumulate in the body even though the person may eat a high calorie diet.

CANCER:
Recent research in Japan and Australia has revealed that advanced cancer of the stomach and bones have been cured successfully. Patients suffering from these kinds of cancer should daily take one tablespoon of honey with one teaspoon of cinnamon powder for one month three times a day.

FATIGUE:
Recent studies have shown that the sugar content of honey is more helpful rather than being detrimental to the strength of the body.

Senior citizens, who take honey and cinnamon powder in equal parts, are more alert and flexible. Dr. Milton, who has done research, says that a half tablespoon of honey taken in a glass of water and sprinkled with cinnamon powder, taken daily after brushing and in the afternoon at about 3:00 P.M. when the vitality of the body starts to decrease, increases the vitality of the body within a week.

BAD BREATH:
People of South America, first thing in the morning, gargle with one teaspoon of honey and cinnamon powder mixed in hot water, so their breath stays fresh throughout the day.

HEARING LOSS:
Daily morning and night honey and cinnamon powder, taken in equal parts restore hearing.

conundrum
06-21-2008, 10:17 AM
I have heard DW say that 20 to 40% of organisms that have been genetically modified repair there dna after about the 5th generation and that we need not worry about it to much but after watching this

[url couldn't be opened and has been removed]

I have decided that maybe there is some thing to worry about especially when a company called Monsantos the company behind the herbicide Roundup will be in total control of the worlds food supplies .

Already small farmers lives and lively hoods are being destroyed around the world not to mention there health and as they point out biodiversity itself, in Australia they have been trying to open the flood gates and unleash this insidious technology (GMO) crops
and after watching the above I can not believe it will be allowed into the country.

I can not help but think that maybe there is a connection between GMO and the declining
bee populations around the world maybe GMO crops can not differentiate between aphids and bee's or maybe agent orange oops I mean Roundup doubles as a pesticide... well it kills people maybe it kills bee's as well :rolleyes:

charran
07-24-2008, 08:41 PM
Colony Collapse Disorder Debunked: Pesticides Cause Bee Deaths

http://www.naturalnews.com/023679.html

Excerpt: The great mystery of bee deaths has been solved. Colony Collapse Disorder is poisoning with a known insect neurotoxin. Clothianidin, a pesticide manufactured by Bayer, has been clearly linked to die offs in Germany and France.

Although the bee die offs that have occurred recently are more severe, there have been many in the past from the same and similar products. In North Dakota, a lawsuit is pending against Bayer for the loss of their bees in 1995, the result of spraying rapeseed with Imidacloprid. In 1999, the same product was banned in France for use as a seed dressing for sunflowers when they lost one-third of their hives after widespread spraying. In 2004, it was banned for use on corn. Recently, France refused to approve Bayer's request to sell Clothianidin.

Clothianidin and Imidacloprid are both members of a class of pesticides called neonicotinoids. They are well known as insect neurotoxins, especially with regard to bees. The spokesperson for the Coalition Against Bayer Dangers, based in Germany, stated, "We have been pointing out the risks of neonicotinoids for almost 10 years now. This proves without a doubt that the chemicals can come into contact with bees and kill them. These pesticides shouldn't be on the market."

for more, go to the link listed above.

Love,

Charran

Happystrings
07-24-2008, 10:13 PM
[QUOTE=Muse;29684]

IN other words, my inner appreciation of them opened the vortex, and I believe that I was given an EMF Negator to open up the vortex around my home even more.

I just noticed the note in here about an EMF Negator. :o What the heck is that? Always learning something here at DC...

Thanks,
HS

hazelom
07-26-2008, 08:54 AM
hi HS, i totally agree, have you read Simon Buxtons book "The Shamanic Way of the Bee", Simon has a website The Sacred Trust, he is a bee shaman! Based in West Country UK . I highly recomend the book, he is the real deal, L+L, hazelom .

[Mr. Buxton has a Bachelor of Science in Marine Biology/Zoology]

SuperManny
07-26-2008, 10:41 AM
[QUOTE=Muse;29684]I just noticed the note in here about an EMF Negator. :o What the heck is that?
It's a little pyramid energy balancer (P.E. BAL for short) that allegedly helps protect you from the bad EMFs by generating a protective field. Might be especially helpful if you're near a cell tower or power lines (if you can afford one :rolleyes:).

[moderator: we don't generally allow posts thru that promote specific gadgets, but since the question came up, we will allow it. Please remember that if you name drop an item, it will generally be removed, but this one slipped thru in error, so we are allowing the explanation]

kilork
08-06-2008, 07:24 AM
http://current.com/items/89139842_study_reveals_signs_of_toxicity_of_ge_mai ze_approved_for_human_consumption?xid=46

[Moderator: this is an article discussing the toxicity level found in some products originally approved for human consumption-please remember to add a short description to your links or we may return them to you for editing]

starwhite
08-07-2008, 12:06 AM
Being diabetic I cannot consume much honey per say, however I do take a cinnamon capsule daily. The cinnamon seems to help lower my blood sugar by making my red blood cells more sensitive to what natural insulin my body still produces. Thank you for the insightful information.

starwhite
08-07-2008, 12:10 AM
My wife and I live on a small 10 acre ranch here in North Dakota. We are totally organic and will not allow spraying or chemicals of any kind to upset the natural balance. I have noted that most of my neighbors spray a variety of chemicals carelessly, sadly laughing at the safety precautions.

The Wonderer
08-07-2008, 08:47 AM
Some people think that the bees are mystical beings who have already shifted into the 4th dimension. That is why the bees suddenly disappeared without a trace according to these people. Even if the prophecies did not occur in 2012, at least it would make people actually come together and love due to the fear of cataclysm or excitement of rebirth. It would cause our government to reveal its sadistic and criminal acts on humanity.

charran
08-30-2008, 11:23 AM
There is no colony collapse disorder regarding the bees. Much of the bee deaths are caused by pesticides and the way that DNA from GMO crops/pesticides mess with the bees DNA.

http://www.naturalnews.com/024024.html
and

http://www.naturalnews.com/023679.

Charran

[second link not working - mod]

charran
08-31-2008, 12:53 PM
Sorry. Don't know how that last link got messed up but here it is.

http://www.naturalnews.com/024024.html

Charran

estopatitiana
09-05-2008, 03:41 PM
well i got the word out on wikipedia, lets see how long it stays up there!!! google honey bees and then click the wikipedia link and scroll down to colony collapse disorder, i added the last line

Understanding
09-05-2008, 06:42 PM
I wondered if they can just clone bees?

metaman
09-06-2008, 12:45 AM
Last I heard, the bees where flat out disappearing. They could not find any of the dead bees. When bees die the colony usually takes the dead bee to a place next to the colony and leaves the body there. Instead the entire colonies simply vanish. They have not been able to tie this to any known toxin in America thus far. That is speculation.

Yes the big chemical companies do tend to shape agricultural trends, however it would not be in there intrest to erase a large quantity of thier market share. They would in the end sell less chemicals this way.

I still think that the bees are going 4d ahead of time. They where already half in, half out. They never did figure out how a bee is capable of flying. Supposed to be impossible according to the aerodynamics involvled. They must have been using hyperdimensional energy to stay aloft.

litllady
09-07-2008, 12:17 PM
I keep hearing this, but my yard has been full of bees. Not saying that its not true, but here, they are thriving well. We used to always try to kill them for they swarm our yard, but my children have become passionate for them for whatever reason.

What I have noticed missing BIG TIME is the lightning bugs. There has been a huge loss of them this year when before the tree lines were full of them.

The promised land in many times talks about the land of milk and honey. To me, this says alot about what the use of animals are for us. We are to use the substances the animals create for us, milk, honey, eggs, fur, medicines ect....I am not sure anymore that we were every supposed to eat animals. If this is so, we have mis used what has been given to us, the precious things we gave ourselves is disappearing because we have misused it.

Another amazing animal that is disappearing is bats. Bats were one of the first mammals to become after the last big extinction, along with snakes and smaller mammals like rats and mice. I live by a huge cave that is being protected because the bats are dwindling in number.

Ever watched the 'Bee movie'? It shows what would happen if the bees stopped working. We wouldnt have flowers or honey. Its a great kids movie. I do hope, for the sake of the beauty of flowers, that the bees find a way. We dont realize how much the beauty of a flower would be missed, until we picture the world without them. If the beauty of the world start to disappear, I think we then have ALOT to worry about. The bees, just like every other living creature, are creators. We dont realize the power of their creation till we think about a world with no flowers. There is nothing like spring time when the varieties bloom forth and show their beauty. There is nothing like showing a child how to smell a flower and see them smile from the wonderful feeling their senses just discovered.

Peace to all,
Lynette

mwr1026
09-07-2008, 09:17 PM
I am a beekeeper on the central coast of California.
Colony Collapse Disorder (CCD) is what beekeepers call the phenomenon that you guys are talking about here. Not all of the bees are disappearing. Some beekeepers have been losing very large numbers of colonies over the past few years, while others have been largely unaffected. There are many theories about what is causing CCD, but the serious researchers will tell you there is no answer to date.
I refer you to the July/August newsletter published by Eric Mussen at UC Davis for the latest.: http://entomology.ucdavis.edu/faculty/mussen/JulAug2008.pdf

In that newsletter, Eric reports that there is some indication that CCD might be waning this year, and that typically such phenomena do go away after a few years. time will tell...

Personally, I am angered and alarmed by the concept of GMO and self-terminating seeds. But this is not the cause of CCD. Two beekeepers with apiaries side by side will have totally different experiences with CCD, even though it is confirmed that their bees are foraging side by side on the same floral sources. (I am not saying that GMO/STS is not killing colonies in some cases...I have no idea...but if so, that is a different issue from CCD.)

CCD is a very strange phenomenon indeed. Normally, when a bee colony dies out, the brood (eggs, larvae, and pupae developing in honey comb) disappears with the bees. European honeybees (the kind we all keep) NEVER abandon brood. But in instances of CCD the adult bees suddenly disappear with a full brood nest abandoned. Also, Other colonies of bees, and also wasps, normally rob all the honey out of an abandoned colony, but in many cases of CCD the abandoned colony is not robbed...The robbers will not touch the hive.

mwr1026
09-07-2008, 10:19 PM
Some people think that the bees are mystical beings who have already shifted into the 4th dimension...

I don't know anything about the notion of whether honeybees are 3rd or 4th density, as suggested. I have always assumed that as insects they must be 2nd density.

On second thought, individual bees hardly even exist. A colony exists as a unified whole, and the individuals simply cease to exist when isolated from that unity, much like antelope in a herd. That is actually very 2D...and a remarkable illustration of the law of one at a 2D level.

However, as a beekeeper of 30 years or so, I can say that there is something about a colony of bees that is truly astonishing. They possess an energy that is supernatural and magical. I cannot describe it. And interacting with a colony of bees, especially when you become sufficiently attuned to their vibration (literally) to be able to open and comfortably work with a hive without protective gear, is a transforming experience that will never be commonplace or ordinary to me.

conundrum
09-07-2008, 11:05 PM
Maybe Monsanto has worked out how to grow self terminating bee's as well so each year when you have to buy seeds from them you will have to buy bee's as well, hang on that doesn't make sense does it self terminating seeds don't need to be pollinated... maybe they are just killing bee's to eliminate the competition that would make good business sense.

Has any one noticed that business sense and natural common sense seems to conflict ?

3D Sunset
09-08-2008, 06:58 AM
Has any one noticed that business sense and natural common sense seems to conflict ?

Along those same lines, have you ever noticed that whenever someone makes a "Management Decision", it's a bad one? Almost as though the term is synonymous with "A stupid decision that someone makes and everyone feels forced to support until its inherent idiocy becomes obvious."

Examples:

- They made a "Management Decision" to launch the Space Shuttle Challenger in January, 1986 inspite of the engineers telling them the o-ring would fail.

- Hurricane Katrina was rife with "Management Decisions", as has been the Iraq war (Rumsfeld is the poster child of Iraq war "Management Decisions").

It's like a code phrase that everyone hears and subconsciously understands, but doesn't react to until after it blows up (irony with Challenger not intended).

Not sure why I felt the need to post this, something just resonated with me.

3D Sunset

PriestOfLight
09-08-2008, 08:45 PM
Along those same lines, have you ever noticed that whenever someone makes a "Management Decision", it's a bad one? Almost as though the term is synonymous with "A stupid decision that someone makes and everyone feels forced to support until its inherent idiocy becomes obvious."

Examples:

- They made a "Management Decision" to launch the Space Shuttle Challenger in January, 1986 inspite of the engineers telling them the o-ring would fail.

- Hurricane Katrina was rife with "Management Decisions", as has been the Iraq war (Rumsfeld is the poster child of Iraq war "Management Decisions").

It's like a code phrase that everyone hears and subconsciously understands, but doesn't react to until after it blows up (irony with Challenger not intended).

Not sure why I felt the need to post this, something just resonated with me.

3D Sunset

I found this resonated with me. Management is devoid of creativity or forward thinking in most cases. It only supports control and alot of fear mongoring. This goes against the Law of Free Will. The business models that make the most sense support Free Will and are positively charged. The only one that I know of at the moment is [please PM for author and title]

My favorite line quote from the book is

You need to be effective with People [Not efficient].

It says alot. The book also includes a push for spirituality in the work place and life. Really great book.

Paul

Jasper
08-28-2009, 07:49 AM
This a fascinating piece from SETI.

When the professor arrived at the nectar source there were no bees present. But when he arrived at the place where the nectar should have been for that day (but had not been moved there yet), there were all the bees waiting for him! Not only had the bees gotten the math correct (25% farther), but the implication is that they had demonstrated the imagination to be able to picture the future by picturing the nectar—not where it was—but where it was going to be!



http://www.space.com/searchforlife/090827-seti-bees-navigation.html

Truth180
08-29-2009, 04:19 PM
I found this resonated with me. Management is devoid of creativity or forward thinking in most cases. It only supports control and alot of fear mongoring. This goes against the Law of Free Will. The business models that make the most sense support Free Will and are positively charged. The only one that I know of at the moment is [please PM for author and title]

My favorite line quote from the book is

You need to be effective with People [Not efficient].

It says alot. The book also includes a push for spirituality in the work place and life. Really great book.

Paul


Some people who are in the management position don't know how to work with people and use thier so called management skills to better the company only. Some of these programs that a company provides for employees has no common sense involved at all, because the only motive is making more money thats it.

Whats missing is they don't follow thier heart or go with their true feelings.

johnboy
08-30-2009, 09:22 AM
Given the fact that mobile telephones use radio waves to communicate and that the atmosphere has been filled with rw's for some time now I hardly find it natural that the honey bees would have "suddenly" disappeared because of cell phones. I would look more at GM crops - re-member that animals such as those in the tsunami of 2004 weren't affected.

The question is this...

What's this telling us?

Be Well, Be Love.

David


David Hackenberg, Bee Keeper in Lewisburg, Pennsylvania, feels the cause of the Colony Collapse is due to genetically modified plants. I talked to him this spring when he delivered some hives for my vegetable garden. He has been quoted on national news coverage of the bee colony collapse. He delivers millions of bees to farmers on the east coast. He also said one more year of reduced bee population will put him out of business.

Deambor
08-30-2009, 03:11 PM
I have hear one explanation of bees disapperance - that is that they are already ascending.

As socialy harmonized creatures, they are the first to move forward in ascention process. To us it looks like disappearance, but they are simply ascending. I don't recall the technical details, but a bee hive is like one entity, and as such it has a unified consciesness.

So in general this explanation sort of makes sense to me, I just don;t know why other socially advanced creatures don't ascend, for example ants.
Or maybe they do too, we just don't notice:)

Love to all

Deambor

mwr1026
08-31-2009, 10:54 AM
I have hear one explanation of bees disapperance - that is that they are already ascending.

As socialy harmonized creatures, they are the first to move forward in ascention process...
the notion of ascending bees is interesting. As I said in a previous post here, I always assumed that because they were insects, bees would be 2D. But having spent half my life around them and observing their behavior intimately, both in the field and in the hive, I have always had a strong spititual sense about them. It has something to do with a perception of heightened energy and peace where ever they are present, especially in significant numbers. That doesn't seem very 2D, or even 3D to me. In fact, there is some component in the presence of honey bees that humans can, if perceptive, detect, but not fully comprehend. Maybe they have been 4D messengers all along.

Liam
08-31-2009, 11:48 AM
Hey Deambor, I noticed that your post is timed at 11:11! This may just be in my time zone, but it would seem that you were talking a lot of sense! Maybe the bees are already ascending. It would certainly make sense given that we are getting closer and closer to 2012. There doesn't seem to be a clear scientific explanation anyway.

Deambor
09-02-2009, 11:13 AM
thanks, not my theory though, I just heard it on YouTube:



(PM for link)