"peak oil", the Arctic and 2012

[FooSnik]

hello gang,

i have come across a couple of things i thought were interesting and i would like to hear anyones' opinion who cares to share.

first of all, i am sure this is not news to most, but i have been reading a lot about "peak oil" which is the time when world oil production will be at its peak and begin its decline. in other words, the demand for oil will be greater than the supply which will generate a whole gang of problems, economic collapse and more war being among them. the most interesting point is that i keep hearing geologists and investors say that the decline will begin right around the year 2012. i was wondering if anyone had some info that i am not aware of, like alternate energy sources, i have heard that our best bet is hydrogen energy and that needs another 30 years of development.

i also saw today in the washington post that nasa climate scientist jay zwally had previously projected the arctic sea ice to melt entirely by 2040, however, after reviewing his own data he says, "at this rate, the arctic ocean could be nearly ice-free at the end of summer by 2012."

is it just me or does this 2012 stuff really seem to be happening? if there is anything that will create really big changes on earth it would be a loss of our oil supply. nearly every function of our civilization depends on it, such as transportation, heat, electricity, chemicals, medicines, and food production. everyone keep your hands inside the ride at all times!!

here is a link for "peak oil" which also provides other links:

http://news.scotsman.com/viewarticle.aspx?articleid=2506337

and a link for the arctic:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/12/11/ar2007121101347.html

don't be shy, please reply. :)

[stargazer]

nikola tesla, a 5-d wanderer, invented free energy almost a hundred years ago. law of one says about his mission:

"ra: i am ra. the most desired purpose of the mind/body/spirit complex, nikola, was the freeing of all planetary entities from the darkness. thus, it attempted to give to the planet the infinite energy of the planetary sphere for use in lighting and power."

but those in power, the dark elite, captured his research papers and started to build ufos:

"questioner: how did the united states learn the technology to build these craft?
ra: i am ra. there was a mind/body/spirit complex know to your people by the vibratory sound complex, nikola. this entity departed the illusion and the papers containing the necessary understandings were taken by mind/body/spirit complexes serving your security of national divisional complex. thus your people became privy to the basic technology. in the case of those mind/body/spirit complexes which you call russians, the technology was given from one of the confederation in an attempt, approximately twenty-seven of your years ago, to share information and bring about peace among your peoples. the entities giving this information were in error, but we did many things at the end of this cycle in attempts to aid your harvest from which we learned the folly of certain types of aid. that is a contributing factor to our more cautious approach at this date, even as the need is power upon power greater, and your peoples call is greater and greater."

so all the knowledge to get rid of oil has been here for a long time. same people who are manufacturing "peak oil" are also building ufos right now! peak oil is most likely same kind of scam like 911 or man-made global warming. it benefits certain entities. i think in near future, before 2012, all these lies come to light as dw has suggested.

[SuperManny]

i agree, the technology is available, and the more you investigate this, the more you find out that there are actually a vast number of technologies available. some of them work with 'zero point' energy, also called 'free energy'. some use anti-gravity energy for propulsion. other forms are available, like solar cells that are capable of putting out a hundred times the power of today's most sophisticated ones,etc.

they are simply suppressed by those that would maintain the status quo. it's for the same reason that ceasar [watt jr] immediately had the man killed who invented the first steam engine . at this point in time they fear that if we were aware of the fact that we had all this energy available for free, nobody would want to go to work anymore and our economy would collapse.

these are simply ideas whose times have not yet come. once the mass consciousness undergoes the necessary transformation, we will have all these things available, and drilling for oil will seem archaic, because there will be many better, easier, and cheaper forms of energy available to all.

[Jasper]

project camelot have received further communication from 'henry deacon'. amongst his latest offering is the following.

11) working free energy systems have been developed, in essence making use of the casimir effect (which henry explained would come as no surprise to most "physicists"). in general, the resulting technologies have been withheld from the public not for economic reasons such as oil interests, but because it had been judged that widely available free energy would only speed the unchecked growth of the world's population - this being regarded by the powers that be as the most pressing problem of our times. due to many religious and other social constructs, addressing the population growth issue appears to have no gentle, timely, easy solution.

_____________________________

so, it's not about the money, it's about controlling/reducing the world population. the ptb's will cull the world population in much the same way that we do with animals who are too prevalent for their overall good. the elephant cull in africa is a good example.

[Penny L]

foosnik--thanks so much for starting this thread. caring for our planet and finding ways to be mutually supportive of all of creation has been in my awareness and on my mind for a long time. i'm open to solutions where everyone wins--including, and especially the earth, who has been the caretaker of humanity from the beginning.

due to it being a fairly warm, nearly-above-freezing day in a wintery nd a couple of days ago, i went outside to soak in some sunshine and fresh air with my cats. we came in smelling like wood smoke--only it was a comforting smell to me. it brought up memories of standing next to the wood stove my mom and dad used as a back-up for heating their home.

i then found myself thanking the trees for supplying the wood, for the comfort the discovery of fire gave humanity, for the gas and oil reserves that fuel our current technologies and for their seeming to now be heading towards depletion.

not because humanity is so selfish and cruel we don't care about those who live here tomorrow--we're living on earth the best way we know how in the moment and using the means available to us in that moment. and frankly, i'm tired of the guilt trips.

i found myself thankful because the possible-seeming depletion of those old energy resources is causing us to become more aware of our interconnectedness with all that is, and it's encouraging us to expand our consciousness, encouraging us to open up and grow in our beingness--discover more treasures we would otherwise miss. like, for instance, a free energy available to, and supportive of all.

there is a place and a time for everything under the sun--to stay in one thing is to stagnate and not discover the next treasures lying in wait just for us.

and for the record--i'm a huge fan of nikola tesla...

thanks again,
penny

[stargazer]

... because it had been judged that widely available free energy would only speed the unchecked growth of the world's population - this being regarded by the powers that be as the most pressing problem of our times. due to many religious and other social constructs, addressing the population growth issue appears to have no gentle, timely, easy solution.


widely available free energy would reduce population growth dramatically. people are having a lot of children because they are poor, uneducated and out of hope and security.

if you are unmarried man/woman with no education, no great wealth or money, and you live in a country which has no working infrastructure, social security, health care or pension insurance, your future looks very grim, because when you are old nobody will feed you or take care of you. so you must get married and have as many children as possible in order to make sure that:
1) at least some of them will survive.
2) at least some of them will work for you (children are being used as free labor in poor countries)
3) at least some of them will feed you when you are old.
4) at least some of them will take care of you when you are old.

so, people are having a lot of children mainly because it is their only available way to survive. in europe only a hundred years ago population growth was as rapid as in africa now. but since the second world war life has been steady and full of wealth in most of the europe, thus there has not been need to have many children. women don’t want to spend their whole adult life giving birth every year because now there are so many other possibilities.

with widely available free energy we could modernize africa and asia in 2-5 years and population growth would stop immediately. religious and social structures are flexible and start to change with modernization. that happened in europe too. this would be a gentle and loving way to solve overpopulation problem. other method is to suppress the technology and deprive people in order to make them reproduce like rabbits and then blame them for doing it. after that we can start killing them to “benefit the entire planet” and pretend to be good guys.

[Jasper]

considering his achievements, isn't it surprising that most people have never heard of tesla. even qualified electicians i know have no knowledge of him. when i ask them who invented ac power, they have no answer. why is he not mentioned in physics classes in schools? the list is endless.the film 'the man who fell to earth' starring david bowie, always reminds me of tesla.

is this situation mirrored in other countries, ie, the total erasing of one of the greatest scientists from the history books !

[Mozart]

(originally by foosnik)

first of all, i am sure this is not news to most, but i have been reading a lot about "peak oil" which is the time when world oil production will be at its peak and begin its decline.




foosnik, et. al.,


regarding the "peak oil" scam, after many, many hours of research on this matter, i can guarantee to you and anyone else 100% that there is _*no*_ such thing as "peak oil"! it's a _*scam!*_


guaranteed.


just type into your search engine this: " deep abiotic russian oil ". that's all you need and you'll find that the russians have totally disproven the stupid, ass-backwards 19th-century-based biotic origins of petroleum and scientifically demonstrated that oil is truly abiotic that results from the internal processes of earth herself. scientifically proven.


so the upshot of this is that we have 1,000's of years worth of oil to use...if we had that kind of time and if the earth could afford to have all that added co2, but, of course we don't have that kind of time (2012) and we can't afford to add that much more co2 to the atmosphere anyways. the point is that there's no shortage of oil at all whatsoever.


of course the western powers don't want anyone to know about this; of course they want to propagandize the stupid "peak oil" scam; of course it is to their benefit that they do so, as they are able to make enormous amounts of money at our expenses in more ways than just from the higher gas prices.


and there's a little-known side "benefit" of the higher gas prices...it allows the illoonynaughty-owned oil corporations to soak up the excess dollars in order to slow down a hyper-inflation-caused collapse of the ever-declining dollar.


russia is now--thanks to their investments that are based on their own abiotic oil theories that have been scientifically proven to be true--the leading oil/gas producer in the world, more so than saudi arabia. the russians simply dig deeper and hit oil just about anywhere, as can anyone else anywhere in the planet; of course some areas don't need to dig as deep, but, generally, any country anywhere can be an oil producer if they dug deep enough.


there's _*8 times*_ more oil below utah/colorado than there is in saudi arabia and the oil can be recoverable at the costs of only $12 to $15 per barrel. there's more oil in gull island in the arctic as there is in saudi arabia; thousands of oil wells have been dug and capped in the gulf of mexico; thousands of oil wells have been dug and capped in southern california, yet we go to war over oil in the middle east?


the wars are not about energy, or the lack thereof, it's about power/control of the masses. if the elites had allowed tesla to do what he was trying to do, the elites would never, ever have gained the power that they have today and the key to the their whole power/control agenda is to control/limit the amount of energy that people have with which to create wealth and to do work.

e=mc2...enslavement = mass control squared.


it all starts with energy...with the limitation/metering of it; after they gained the ability to do that and the elimination of the tesla problem, then they focused on getting the linchpin to their entire empire: money and the control thereof, hence they created the federal reserve, their own private bank that not only "funds" the current corporate federal "government" as we know it today, they were also able to fund two world wars, the displacement of millions of people, the murder of millions of people world-wide, the financing of the bolshevik revolution, the financing of the rise of hitler and so on and so on.


it's simple:

1) control/limit/meter energy available for the people worldwide.

2)control/limit/meter the money available to people worldwide.

3)use the pharmaceutical/medical complex to keep people in perpetual states of disease and weaknesses so that they can't ever get healthy and productively vibrant.

4)use the military/industrial complex to enforce their above-mentioned monopolies.



the three biggest industries in the world are:

1)usury (banking--all banks in the world, 'cept for iran, cuba, libya, sudan and north korea--those five are the only ones who do not have usury/interest-based banking) all the rest of the banks in the world are owned/controlled by the illoonynaughies; however, the illoonynaughties have lost their control of russia, china and india, so their power is already on the wane just when they have hit the zenith.

2)pharmaceuticals--both illegal and legal--it is designed to not only be enormously profitable, but also to keep the masses perpetually diseased. the money made in this allows the funding of many black-op, off-budget projects that are favored by the illoonynaughties.

3)military--the enforcers of the corporate-driven fascism and another key black-op, off-budget funding mechanism.


surrounding the central, pivot-point of the fiat banking system are the pharma-industrial complex and the military-industrial complex that dominates most financial/political/energy activity in the world.


the scam if "peak oil" is an essential propaganda ploy endlessly drummed into the masses through the media to keep power--literally and figuratively--in the hands of the elite and out of the hands of the ever-going-broke people.


don't get fooled into thinking that "peak oil" has any sort of truth to it.

.

[LightEye]

dear friends,

more on abiotic oil. in the end you have to decide what you wish to believe.

link to 1st article;
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/100404_abiotic_oil.shtml

link to 2nd article;
http://www.altpr.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=news&file=article&sid=331&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0

matt savinar does lots of work concerning peak oil and while i don't agree with his "doom and gloom" he does post lots of links which relate to peak
oil. here's the link to his site;

http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/index.html

be well, be love.

david

abiotic oil: science or politics?
by ugo bardi
www.aspoitalia.net

[ugo bardi is professor of chemistry at the university of florence, italy. he is also member of the aspo (association for the study of peak oil). he is the author of the book "la fine del petrolio" (the end of oil) and of several studies on oil depletion.

ugo bardi offers a simple assessment of the abiotic theory. his logic is so clear, and the culmination of his argument is so cogent, that even a child could understand it. and the conclusion is inescapable - at least to honest enquiry - abiotic theory is false, or at best irrelevant. -dap]

october 4, 2004: 1300 pdt (ftw) -- for the past century or so, the biological origin of oil seemed to be the accepted norm. however, there remained a small group of critics who pushed the idea that, instead, oil is generated from inorganic matter within the earth's mantle.

the question might have remained within the limits of a specialized debate among geologists, as it has been until not long ago. however, the recent supply problems have pushed crude oil to the center stage of international news. this interest has sparked a heated debate on the concept of the "production peak" of crude oil. according to the calculations of several experts, oil production may reach a maximum within a few years and start a gradual decline afterwards.

the “abiotic oil” controversy
by richard heinberg

in recent months a few of the many web sites that challenge the official account of the events of 9/11/2001 have also attacked the idea of peak oil. i would prefer to ignore this controversy—and there are good reasons for doing so, as some of these web sites lack credibility on other counts; nevertheless, as these sites are magnets for large numbers of people who are just beginning to find their way out of the consensus societal trance, they appear to be doing some palpable harm. i have received at least a couple of dozen e-mails from sincere people wanting to know my response to claims that “peak oil” is a scam, and that oil is actually an inexhaustible resource.

so, once and for all, here is my take on the abiotic oil controversy.

info from matt savinar's site;

dear reader,

civilization as we know it is coming to an end soon. this is not the wacky proclamation of a doomsday cult, apocalypse bible prophecy sect, or conspiracy theory society. rather, it is the scientific conclusion of the best paid, most widely-respected geologists, physicists, bankers, and investors in the world. these are rational, professional, conservative individuals who are absolutely terrified by a phenomenon known as global "peak oil."

"are we 'running out'? i thought there was 40 years of the stuff left"

oil will not just "run out" because all oil production follows a bell curve. this is true whether we're talking about an individual field, a country, or on the planet as a whole.

oil is increasingly plentiful on the upslope of the bell curve, increasingly scarce and expensive on the down slope. the peak of the curve coincides with the point at which the endowment of oil has been 50 percent depleted. once the peak is passed, oil production begins to go down while cost begins to go up.

[Mozart]

link to 1st article;
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/100404_abiotic_oil.shtml




this link above is from mike ruppert's site. mike ruppert is a paid (by the cia, no less) "peak oil" shill. he cannot be taken seriously on this matter at all. i met the guy and i don't like him, for good reason.



link to 2nd article;
http://www.altpr.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=news&file=article&sid=331&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0



i swear, just about every anti-abiotic, pro-peak-oil article that i read quotes this plagiarist, thomas gold, extensively! good god!


read this:

http://www.gasresources.net/plagiarism(overview).htm


now read this:

http://freeenergynews.com/directory/theory/sustainableoil/


it's notabout what you believe, it's about the evidence! like in csi, "the evidence does not lie" and i stand firmly on the ground of solid, scientific evidence that shows conclusively that "peak oil" is a scam and that petroleum as we know it is created by the deep processes by our own earth mother herself.

follow the evidence, not the theories!

[onething]

hmmm... i have thomas gold's book, the deep hot biosphere, which does give credence to russian/ukrainian scientists as having an abiotic theory, furthermore, his book is filled with some pretty interesting arguments about how the deep biosphere might have been the real source of the evolution of life (altho i personally follow the intelligent design model, and not darwinian evolution, he is the only person who has given arguments that gave me pause) as well as the formation of metals and the cause of earthquakes.

i'm sorry if he's a plagiarist but it's one of the best books i've got for nonmainstream science.

[LightEye]

dear friends,

just for fun...

keep an eye on this site for news concerning peak oil;

http://www.energybulletin.net/

be well, be love.

david

oil and gas - a short period of history for great britain
http://www.peakoil.net/oilgasuk.html

"this is now confirmed by the uk department of trade and industry that recently published a plot showing that by the year 2020 it is more or less all over."

things just got worse
by byron w. king
http://www.energybulletin.net/12336.html

no, make it a lot worse. word just came out that kuwait, long regarded as home to some of the world's largest reserves of petroleum, may possess only half the amount of oil reserves that it officially has been stating for many years.

norwegian authorities fear steep crude decline
by jan herdal
http://www.energybulletin.net/29073.html

this is a direct quotation by norwegian oil director mr. gunnar berge from the foreword to facts - the norwegian petroleum sector - 2007 (220-page pdf) published by the norwegian ministry of petroleum and energy on friday, april w0:

forecasts show that gas production is rising while oil production is declining. the number of exploration wells increased significantly in 2006 compared with the previous year, but only six new discoveries were made. these were made in four wellbores. this is figures for reflection [stet]. if we are to achieve the development that we want, with only a slow and gradual decline, serious efforts must be made in several areas.

what is the norwegian oil director actually predicting here?

he is establishing "a slow and gradual decline" as a best case scenario for norway, concluding that "serious efforts must be made in several areas" to achieve it. the alternative scenario? steep decline


trouble in the world's largest oil field-ghawar
copyright 2004 g.r. morton this can be freely distributed so long as no changes are made and no charges are made.
july 4, 2004 updated sept 2006.

http://home.entouch.net/dmd/ghawar.htm

there are four oil fields in the world which produce over one million barrels per day. ghawar, which produces 4.5 million barrels per day, cantarell in mexico, which produces nearly 2 million barrels per day, burgan in kuwait which produces 1.7 million barrels per day and da qing in china which produces 1 million barrels per day. ghawar is, therefore, extremely important to the world's economy and well being. today the world produces 82.5 million barrels per day which means that ghawar produces 5.5 percent of the world's daily production. should it decline, there would be major problems. as ghawar goes, so goes saudi arabia.

the field was brought on line in 1951. by 1981 it was producing 5.7 million barrels per day. its production was restricted during the 1980s but by 1996 with the addition of two other areas in the southern area of ghawar brought on production, hawiyah and haradh, the production went back up above 5 million per day. in 2001 it was producing around 4.5 million barrels per day. there have been 3400 wells drilled into this reservoir

i have noted elsewhere that the data i am being told by engineers who have actually worked on ghawar, that this decade will see it's peak. (morton, 2004 pscf in press). others have noted how the percentage of water brought up with the oil has been growing on ghawar. there are published reports that ghawar has from 30-55% water cut. this means that about half the fluids brought up the well are water. today the decline rate is 8%. thousands of barrels per day of production must be added each year.

"the big risk in saudi arabia is that ghawar's rate of decline increases to an alarming point," said ali morteza samsam bakhtiari, a senior official with the national iranian oil company. "that will set bells ringing all over the oil world because ghawar underpins saudi output and saudi undergirds worldwide production." jeff gerth, "forecast of rising oil demand challenges tired saudi fields," february 24, 2004 new york times, late edition - final , section a , page 1 , column 3 http://www.peakoil.net/newspapers/20040224nyttiredsaudifields.doc

unfortunately for the world, few know the actual state of ghawar. cumulative production from the field is 55 billion barrels. in 1975 exxon, mobil, chevron and texaco estimated that the ultimate recovery from the field would be 60 billion barrels. without a doubt, new technologies have moved eurs from that which was possible in the mid 1970s. but the saudis claim that the field can recover another 125 billion barrels.(this info come from http://www.simmonsco-intl.com/files/iea-som.pdf slide 25 accessed 7-5-04) for someone like me who has spent a lifetime in the oil industry trebling the recovery factor is a fantasy we all wish we could do. but no one has ever figured out how. thus, i doubt very much their claims, especially in light of the maps shown below.

[FooSnik]

wow, thanks everyone for your highly informative responses. that far exceeded my expectations and was all the more poignant coming from a holiday with family and friends that have more or less the standard "oh that is a conspiracy theory!" response or even worse the apathetic response of, "i don't know about that but my redskins played a great game!" :rolleyes:

i had never heard of the biotic vs. abiotic or deep oil vs. peak oil argument before today. once again my head is spinning with two very possible theories both backed up with hard scientific evidence, except i guess you could say the "peak oil" argument is less hard science and more conjecture but they are still successful in making a strong argument. i did google "deep abiotic russian oil" and what i read is very interesting. i can't help but wonder that if russia has had knowledge of a vast unlimited oil supply and have successfully tapped into it for the last 30 years then why haven't they established themselves as the world's dominant power, since power depends on the control and metering of energy? i don't think putin or russia is on any higher spiritual level than us and i am sure they would love to be the new world super power so wouldn't the knowledge of having an unlimited power source give them the leverage to have pushed their way to the top?

also mozart, i was wondering where you got this information:


there's _*8 times*_ more oil below utah/colorado than there is in saudi arabia and the oil can be recoverable at the costs of only $12 to $15 per barrel. there's more oil in gull island in the arctic as there is in saudi arabia; thousands of oil wells have been dug and capped in the gulf of mexico; thousands of oil wells have been dug and capped in southern california, yet we go to war over oil in the middle east?

i am not saying you are not right but it is a hard one to believe. can you give me some references so i can read about that? i do know a lot about the federal reserve and our fractional reserve banking system so your formula,


1) control/limit/meter energy available for the people worldwide.

2)control/limit/meter the money available to people worldwide.

3)use the pharmaceutical/medical complex to keep people in perpetual states of disease and weaknesses so that they can't ever get healthy and productively vibrant.

4)use the military/industrial complex to enforce their above-mentioned monopolies.


makes a lot of sense to me. one thing though is that i have not seen much of this "peak oil" theory in our main stream media. you say that they are "drumming" it into our psyche but the only place i see anything about it is on the internet which would more lead me to believe that they do not care for us to have too much knowledge of this info. unless, of course, if the powers that be are masterfully manipulating the info to slowly release it on an internet only basis in order to let it slowly seep into the mainstream and bypass a growing distrust of the mainstream media. i for one own a severe distrust for mainstream media and the moment i sense the slightest hint of them beating their propaganda drums i shut down. but isn't that a little too over the top paranoid? :eek: or then again maybe not.

and i had only been slightly aware of who nikola tesla was and i look forward to learning more about him and his theories.

very refreshing everyone, thanks.